Commercial Gill Nets Target BASS in Lake WA

[GWP]

They won’t ‘get rid of’ the bass. They ‘might’ knock down the numbers some for a while. It’s like the Asian Carp. Once they arrive, they are pretty much there to stay. Unless you kill the entire lake. What is Lake Wa? 17K acres? I doubt they could kill it off if they tried.

[duckmen1]

Destroyed?   You can't get spiny rayed fish out of almost any body of water of any real size.  Bass will take a few years but they'll blast right back into place. I fish perch a few years after the retenone treatments in "trout" lakes.  I just see a risk reward discussion.  Risk of losing bass in lake WA, Zero.  Risk of losing salmon, significant.  One of these is native and irreplaceable, one you can't get rid of no matter what you do.

So I guess this proves my point a little. They will lower bass populations this year. Fishing will suck. And by the time bass recover as they will they will be back to eating smolt and you still won't see a salmon fishery. Due to the amount of time it takes to recover. then bass guys are frustrated and its a loss all the way around.
For sure it may make a short term difference a little but we need management in many ways including seals and sea lions at the mouth of the lake along the locks.

 The same can be said about wolves and mule deer. Are we to simply say screw it and let the deer herds disappear?

Isn't that what this state is doing about deer herds?  Lol point proven.

In all seriousness it is sad to see this state come to this. Where we keep having to sacrifice everything and see no positive results in return. Due to the fixes that are being put in place need to be more than one thing but a series of complex strategies to keep up with things until recovery happens. As recreational fisherman we did some on our end and ended the fishery and of course allowed it since numbers weren't there. But predation in commerants isn't being addressed federally even though the pacific flyway is the only flyway with no management. Seals and sea lions I would think tribes would have a say as they do on some of the columbia now. Implement that along the locks and reduce netting for salmon a few years along with adding netting with bass and push for more hatchery production. Add all these things together and you will see a good recovery. 

[Mfowl]

Predation by bass is blatantly obvious if you go fishing on Lk Wa or Samm right now through May. There are topwater hits w/smolts skippin away everywhere. The bass you catch are spitting out smolts. I've caught 9 species of fish in one day on Lk Samm using smolt lures this time of year. Everything hammers on the smolts. But I don't think netting the bass will save the salmon. I don't think there are more bass than the last time there was a sockeye season on Lk Wa in 2006, and that was a massive return. I bass fished both lakes back then too. The Columbia consistently returns plenty of sockeye and there piles of predatory fish in it. I think it has more to do with pollution/ development and warm water as mentioned. 

[Tbar]

Destroyed?   You can't get spiny rayed fish out of almost any body of water of any real size.  Bass will take a few years but they'll blast right back into place. I fish perch a few years after the retenone treatments in "trout" lakes.  I just see a risk reward discussion.  Risk of losing bass in lake WA, Zero.  Risk of losing salmon, significant.  One of these is native and irreplaceable, one you can't get rid of no matter what you do.

So I guess this proves my point a little. They will lower bass populations this year. Fishing will suck. And by the time bass recover as they will they will be back to eating smolt and you still won't see a salmon fishery. Due to the amount of time it takes to recover. then bass guys are frustrated and its a loss all the way around.
For sure it may make a short term difference a little but we need management in many ways including seals and sea lions at the mouth of the lake along the locks.

 The same can be said about wolves and mule deer. Are we to simply say screw it and let the deer herds disappear?

Isn't that what this state is doing about deer herds?  Lol point proven.

In all seriousness it is sad to see this state come to this. Where we keep having to sacrifice everything and see no positive results in return. Due to the fixes that are being put in place need to be more than one thing but a series of complex strategies to keep up with things until recovery happens. As recreational fisherman we did some on our end and ended the fishery and of course allowed it since numbers weren't there. But predation in commerants isn't being addressed federally even though the pacific flyway is the only flyway with no management. Seals and sea lions I would think tribes would have a say as they do on some of the columbia now. Implement that along the locks and reduce netting for salmon a few years along with adding netting with bass and push for more hatchery production. Add all these things together and you will see a good recovery.

This is incorrect, along with several other assertions/assumptions in your post.

[duckmen1]

Destroyed?   You can't get spiny rayed fish out of almost any body of water of any real size.  Bass will take a few years but they'll blast right back into place. I fish perch a few years after the retenone treatments in "trout" lakes.  I just see a risk reward discussion.  Risk of losing bass in lake WA, Zero.  Risk of losing salmon, significant.  One of these is native and irreplaceable, one you can't get rid of no matter what you do.

So I guess this proves my point a little. They will lower bass populations this year. Fishing will suck. And by the time bass recover as they will they will be back to eating smolt and you still won't see a salmon fishery. Due to the amount of time it takes to recover. then bass guys are frustrated and its a loss all the way around.
For sure it may make a short term difference a little but we need management in many ways including seals and sea lions at the mouth of the lake along the locks.

 The same can be said about wolves and mule deer. Are we to simply say screw it and let the deer herds disappear?

Isn't that what this state is doing about deer herds?  Lol point proven.

In all seriousness it is sad to see this state come to this. Where we keep having to sacrifice everything and see no positive results in return. Due to the fixes that are being put in place need to be more than one thing but a series of complex strategies to keep up with things until recovery happens. As recreational fisherman we did some on our end and ended the fishery and of course allowed it since numbers weren't there. But predation in commerants isn't being addressed federally even though the pacific flyway is the only flyway with no management. Seals and sea lions I would think tribes would have a say as they do on some of the columbia now. Implement that along the locks and reduce netting for salmon a few years along with adding netting with bass and push for more hatchery production. Add all these things together and you will see a good recovery.

This is incorrect, along with several other assertions/assumptions in your post.

I have looked quite deeply into cormorant management in the US. In 3 flyways across the US there are over 50,000 permits issued for nuisance issues associated with cormorants. And the federal reports have shown 0 permits issued along the Pacific flyway. With the exception of Alaska. Please feel free to touch more on my "incorrect assertions/assumptions on comorants". Please show me records of where management is taken place with cormorants.

I believe we need to do many management practices to see a good result in recovery. Who can argue that and say that is incorrect. Wouldn't you agree there are many predators, not just warm water species such as bass. Habitat loss and pollution. Possibly less production from the state on hatcheries whether its sockeye or other species, netting practices, commercial harvest outside our state, bad ocean conditions, etc. I can go on and on but appears I am an idiot for thinking that killing bass will be the cure all. Sure they need to be managed not saying they don't. Give it 5 heck even 8 years and see how well this one net approach fixes the run. I will continue to believe that in 5 years we still won't see big returns and a fishery for recreational from this warmwater species netting only approach. And if it does open from this one step fix all approach I guess then I will call myself an idiot. Rant over.

[Tbar]

Federal processes take time.

https://wildlife.org/usfws-finalizes-cormorant-management-rule/

[Tbar]

I believe it took effect mid February.

[duckmen1]

You are right about the new rule taking effect february 12 2021. Just looked into it. I spent all last year researching comorant management. Surprised to see that a new rule just went into place after all this time. Let's hope that the new rule will see some changes in management practices. It Definitely took them long enough to put a management rule in place and let's hope to see them follow through with it. And use management practices and not just use hazing techniques only. Actually really happy to see that getting set up.

[huntnphool]

Destroyed?   You can't get spiny rayed fish out of almost any body of water of any real size.  Bass will take a few years but they'll blast right back into place. I fish perch a few years after the retenone treatments in "trout" lakes.  I just see a risk reward discussion.  Risk of losing bass in lake WA, Zero.  Risk of losing salmon, significant.  One of these is native and irreplaceable, one you can't get rid of no matter what you do.

So I guess this proves my point a little. They will lower bass populations this year. Fishing will suck. And by the time bass recover as they will they will be back to eating smolt and you still won't see a salmon fishery. Due to the amount of time it takes to recover. then bass guys are frustrated and its a loss all the way around.
For sure it may make a short term difference a little but we need management in many ways including seals and sea lions at the mouth of the lake along the locks.

 The same can be said about wolves and mule deer. Are we to simply say screw it and let the deer herds disappear?

Isn't that what this state is doing about deer herds?  Lol point proven.

In all seriousness it is sad to see this state come to this. Where we keep having to sacrifice everything and see no positive results in return. Due to the fixes that are being put in place need to be more than one thing but a series of complex strategies to keep up with things until recovery happens. As recreational fisherman we did some on our end and ended the fishery and of course allowed it since numbers weren't there. But predation in commerants isn't being addressed federally even though the pacific flyway is the only flyway with no management. Seals and sea lions I would think tribes would have a say as they do on some of the columbia now. Implement that along the locks and reduce netting for salmon a few years along with adding netting with bass and push for more hatchery production. Add all these things together and you will see a good recovery.

This is incorrect, along with several other assertions/assumptions in your post.

And if it does open from this one step fix all approach I guess then I will call myself an idiot.

 I missed the post, or the part in the article that said this is a one step fix all.

 

[duckmen1]

I have read articles in years past and talked to Muckleshoots associated with netting on Lake Sammamish. They claim that roughly 80% of smolt are killed off by warmwater species before making it to the salt. And say if they get rid of that predation it will solve the runs. No this is not my assumption or assertion this is what I am being told. So saying a one step fix all is based off of that. In which I don't agree with either. As I said one step of many that needs to take place. Many management practices need to be seen and I believe we both can agree on that.

[Tbar]

Duckmen1 you are on track. I agree with most of what you're saying except the single track and lack of action. Many processes are miserably slow and have limiting factors that  often feel insurmountable. Impoundments, ag, development, intercept fisheries, international agreements(or lack there of), mmpa- you touch on many of them. The wdfw just finished their periodic status review on sea lions.  Jeffries just reaffirmed seal populations as well as assessments/recommendations. Things are happening, not nearly as fast as any of us would like, but they are.

[Tbar]

I have read articles in years past and talked to Muckleshoots associated with netting on Lake Sammamish. They claim that roughly 80% of smolt are killed off by warmwater species before making it to the salt. And say if they get rid of that predation it will solve the runs. No this is not my assumption or assertion this is what I am being told. So saying a one step fix all is based off of that. In which I don't agree with either. As I said one step of many that needs to take place. Many management practices need to be seen and I believe we both can agree on that.

Where is the one step fix assertion?

[Duckslayer89]

The number one thing killing salmon is development. Politicians won’t touch that though- too many of them have their hands in that cookie jar. Netting the bass won’t bring back sockeye. But whatever, kill the bass. Then you won’t have sockeye or bass to fish for.

Sincerely,

A duck hunter who has lost too much habitat to “salmon restoration”.

  Love this

[huntnphool]

I have read articles in years past and talked to Muckleshoots associated with netting on Lake Sammamish. They claim that roughly 80% of smolt are killed off by warmwater species before making it to the salt. And say if they get rid of that predation it will solve the runs. No this is not my assumption or assertion this is what I am being told. So saying a one step fix all is based off of that. In which I don't agree with either. As I said one step of many that needs to take place. Many management practices need to be seen and I believe we both can agree on that.

 You just admitted there is info out there suggesting high mortality due to “warmwater species”, yet are going on and on against the tribes attempting to due something about it.

 Did you recently purchase a bass boat to fish Lake Washington!

[duckmen1]

First off dude my post also say that I am not in denial of bass predation. Thats pretty obvious. I have also said that if multiple management practices are done sure have at it. All I have said repeatedly is that we won't see a sockeye fishery due to solely netting of bass. And yes it does suck to watch fisherman loose out on yet another good fishery. Sure bass will rebound but that proves my point again toward you. It won't make a difference. No I don't personally like to fish washington for bass even though it's a good fishery. So makes no difference to me personally for my outings. Trust me I catch a ton of bass and good quality at most places I go.
But answer this. How long will it be before a sockeye fishery opens up for you based off of this netting??? Would love to hear a time frame of predictions.

Funny how they netted Sammamish and numbers of kings have been on a decline for a number of years now. So far numbers aren't going up. Just saying. But I will give that another 4 years and see. With similar production from hatchery let's see how high the numbers of returning fish don't rise.