What would you do with 23 elk points?

[bucklucky]

Margret or the Toutle, there are masher bulls everywhere in there. I got guys that tell me about all the 350 class bulls they see in there all the time 

I hunted in Margaret 2 years in a row- 2007, and 2008, and there MIGHT be 1 or 2 350 bulls in there.  For the most part, a 6x6 is a trophy there, and the biggest I saw wouldn't have broke 300!  Go to the BLUES!!!

Obviousely you dont know what your looking at ..... JK  I was beeing sarcastic, trust me I know what is on there. Top end bulls are in that 280-290 range with just a few in the 300's for the most part. Alot of 250 type bulls though. 

[bucklucky]

-That graph shows exactly how much of a joke the washington points system is. 

At leat everyone has a chance to draw, just better odds if you got a bagillion points is all.

[Skyvalhunter]

Yea it's alot better than some of the other states where the tags go to the highest points. Atleast you have a small chance of drawing.

[Bob33]

Yea it's alot better than some of the other states where the tags go to the highest points. Atleast you have a small chance of drawing.

That's the good and bad of our system.  If our system were purely preference like some states, the person with 23 points would be guaranteed to draw the Dayton tag.  The person with five points now would be guaranteed to draw in 23 years if no other hunters entered the pool other than those already in.  For the first 22 years, his odds of drawing would be zero.

[Kent Hunter]

This is short but sweet. Buy a West side tag and put in for GMU 485 Green River. I work for the railroad and we run trains through there on the run to Ellensburg from Seattle. There are some MONSTER bulls in there. ALOT of bulls!!

[dreamingbig]

I have a question about the draw system.  My understanding was that all applicants for a particular specie/type of permit (i.e. elk, quality bull) and user group (i.e. modern firearm) got put into the same barrel (point weighted).  Then they start drawing names out of that barrel.  If you are successfully drawn, then they look at what you selected for your 1st and 2nd choice.  If your first choice is available then you are allocated to that hunt, if not then they go to your second choice.  If your 1st and 2nd choice are both full when you are drawn then you become "not selected" even though there are other hunts still available.  Then they draw the next name out of the barrel and keep doing so until all permits are allocated.  You are never told if you were drawn but your hunt choices were full already (this would be good to know).

Is this correct or do you believe that they have individual barrels for each specific hunt?  i.e. The barrel for dayton quality bull for modern firearm is only filled with those who chose it as their first or second choices?

I thought the way it worked was the first scenario I described but it seems that some are suggesting it works like the second scenario?

[trophyhunt]

This is short but sweet. Buy a West side tag and put in for GMU 485 Green River. I work for the railroad and we run trains through there on the run to Ellensburg from Seattle. There are some MONSTER bulls in there. ALOT of bulls!!

SSSHHHHHHH.

[rasbo]

This is short but sweet. Buy a West side tag and put in for GMU 485 Green River. I work for the railroad and we run trains through there on the run to Ellensburg from Seattle. There are some MONSTER bulls in there. ALOT of bulls!!

side note kent hunter,when you go through the stampede tunnel and you see the words above the tunnel I did the drilling to put them in,it was a blast working off a train,

[SkookumHntr]

-That graph shows exactly how much of a joke the washington points system is. 

At leat everyone has a chance to draw, just better odds if you got a bagillion points is all.

-Look at that graph, at that time 14pts were top without poacher points. 1 person drew with 14 points. I think thats *censored*!

[MtnMuley]

I agree skookum.  As I've mentioned before, I'd like a weighted point system where 50% of the tags go to those in the top 10-20% of the point pool.

[Alan K]

Here are actual draw results for Hunt #2005, Dayton A in 2009:

This data indicates there would have been 49,206 names in the hat.  Someone with 23 points would have 529 names in the hat.  For each of the 21 permits drawn, that individual would have approximately a 1% chance of being drawn.

Hey Bob, where did you find that breakdown of info?

[trophyhunt]

I agree skookum.  As I've mentioned before, I'd like a weighted point system where 50% of the tags go to those in the top 10-20% of the point pool.

I also agree that 50% of the tags should go to the ones with the most points, and yes I would think the same thing if I only had 2 points.

[willapawapiti]

    Dreaminbig, I believe your second scenario is correct.  Each hunt has it's own "barrel".  For instance, you have equal chance of drawing your first choice hunt as your fourth choice (many don't know that).  The "choice" order only comes in if you get drawn in two or more "barrels" in same category that year.  If that happens, you will be given your first choice over your second choice, second over your third, etc.  
  

[SkookumHntr]

I agree skookum.  As I've mentioned before, I'd like a weighted point system where 50% of the tags go to those in the top 10-20% of the point pool.

I also agree that 50% of the tags should go to the ones with the most points, and yes I would think the same thing if I only had 2 points.

- Ya and the guy with 1 point still has a chance! or a minumum amount of points to apply for certain hunts! Anything but what it is now! Getting the guys at the top of the points ladder drawn and back down to zero is the only way to actually increase the odds for everybody else!

[arees]

I have a question about the draw system.  My understanding was that all applicants for a particular specie/type of permit (i.e. elk, quality bull) and user group (i.e. modern firearm) got put into the same barrel (point weighted).  Then they start drawing names out of that barrel.  If you are successfully drawn, then they look at what you selected for your 1st and 2nd choice.  If your first choice is available then you are allocated to that hunt, if not then they go to your second choice.  If your 1st and 2nd choice are both full when you are drawn then you become "not selected" even though there are other hunts still available.  Then they draw the next name out of the barrel and keep doing so until all permits are allocated.  You are never told if you were drawn but your hunt choices were full already (this would be good to know).

Is this correct or do you believe that they have individual barrels for each specific hunt?  i.e. The barrel for dayton quality bull for modern firearm is only filled with those who chose it as their first or second choices?

I thought the way it worked was the first scenario I described but it seems that some are suggesting it works like the second scenario?

The hunt choices are explained here: http://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/permits/wps_faq.html#11

Q:    How do the hunt choices work?
A: When the drawing occurs, it is as if all of the applications for a species category are placed in a barrel. The computer spins the barrel by issuing random numbers to each application. The lowest random number that is issued to each application is the number used to order the applications from the lowest random number to the highest. It is the same as drawing cards from a barrel one by one. The application with the lowest random number is drawn first from the barrel and the hunt choices are checked. As each application comes up for consideration, the first hunt choice is checked to see if there is a permit left to be awarded. If there are none left, the second hunt choice is checked. If there is a permit available for that hunt choice, the application is selected for that hunt. If not, the process continues until all of the hunt choices on the application have been checked. If all of the hunt choices marked on the card have run out of permits, no permits are awarded to that application.

This means that if you get drawn for Quality Elk Hunts, all your choices for Quality Elk Hunts would be considered before anyone else's Quality Elk Hunt choices would be considered.