Stocks - McMillan vs Bell and Carlson

[FOsteology]

All of my rifles stocked with a McMillan are pillar and glass bedded. Everyone of them also shoots sub MOA consistently with factory fodder. Another benefit is I can break them down (remove from stock) for transport, reassemble and as of date haven't had to re-zero (knock on wood).

There are other compelling reasons to go with a McMillan as I have previously outlined.

[Tony 270WSM]

What do the pillars really add that you don't otherwise get from the McM? Did you have them do it, or someone else?

[FOsteology]

What do the pillars really add that you don't otherwise get from the McM? Did you have them do it, or someone else?

Pillars prevent the guard screws from compressing or crushing the stock in the action area.

McMillans are solid fiberglass in the action area. So technically, there is no need to install pillars. However, the EDGE require pillars as they're comprised of 100% graphite plus high tech resins. McMillan supplies the EDGE standard with pillars for this very reason.

If one is going to shell out the dough on a McMillan (because you want the best out there), spending an additional $25 to have pillars installed is great peace of mind, and totally eliminates any possibility of compression, as well as allowing you to get the same "fit" every time you take the barreled action out of the stock.


Most of my McMillan's are EDGE. The others I had McMillan add the pillars to my stock order.

[Tony 270WSM]

Thanks for the info

[demontang]

I have a friends rifle with an HS on it and its a nice stock, but I think they want a little much for them. I have a weatherby in 338 win with a factory stock I reworked that went from shooting 1.5" group to sub moa. I dont think you need to spend a lot of money to have a great shooting hunting rifle, but if youre into comp shooting then I could see it being worth it. 

[FOsteology]

Potential accuracy improvement is but one small part/reason to consider swapping out a stock.

Weight, construction, fit and feel(both for shooter and barreled action), handling, balance, and improved felt recoil absorption just to name a few.

One needs to look at and consider the BIG picture when contemplating restocking...

[Tony 270WSM]

Mainly I just don't care for the XCR stock and the rubbery features to it. Also, I can easily pull the foreend of the stock so it touches the barrel. Seems too flimsy. I wouldn't mind checking out the B&C that comes on the Ti 700s and seeing about getting a take-off. Would be quite a bit easier if I could feel and handle each of them.

[FOsteology]

I've driven a few Ti stocks. Don't care for the thick grip personally, and there's no shell from solid sheets of glass... just chopped glass/graphite.

The Rem Ti stocks are OK for most purposes. Definitely a step up from the typical tupperware stocks. Although nice and light, they're not the same strength-wise as glass sheets forming the skin like McMillan, Borden, Bansner, Brown, etc.

[JoshT]

I've owned a few McMillans... all of them on custom rifles. I've had the Sako Hunter, the Rem. Classic, and the BDL. I ended up selling them all... and stocking with HS Precisions. I just prefer the HS... they fit me well... all but one of the rifles is more accurate in the HS than the McM (the other is equally accurate)... and most importantly they shoot to the same POI no matter the rest, something I can't say for the same rifles when they wore the Mickeys.

[FOsteology]

I've had a few HS stocks, and have handled a handful of rifles so equipped.... and probably going to upset those that like them, but to me personally I found them to be crap.

You have very different materials comprising them. The aluminum bedding block, and the fiber glass shell with a foam core. Put them together and cook them to finish the stock and 7 out of 10 will warp when you torque the action into the stock.

HS ergonomics are horrific, and tend to amplify recoil. The aluminum bedding blocks are just an un-needed added expense and a complete joke. They serve no real useful purpose other than to mask the inferior fill used that would not otherwise hold up to recoil. Good synthetic stocks do not need them.

HS stocks are routinely heavier than they need to be (I think that HS knows that their stocks suck at controlling recoil, so add weight to mitigate). Did I mention the ergo's suck?

Inletting is hit or miss and the stocks typically requires more work than it's worth to get bedded properly.

Ever notice how second-hand HS stocks get about 40-50% on resale, and second-hand McMillan get about 85-90% ??

There's a reason for that.


Now, having said that, the HS work's well for a heavy tactical rifle. The US Army has had good luck with them for years. But for a standard hunting rifle, I'd look elsewhere. 

[JoshT]

Whatever...

[FOsteology]

Whatever...

Compelling rebuttal... 

[Bofire]

 :)Like Whoa Dude
Its like so totally 'whatever'.

The reasons there are advances in products is we all dont like the same things. There are ZERO products that are ALL good, all pleasing, all useful.
William knows a ton about rifles and has had many customs, we dont like the same things in rifles, but that does not mean either of us is 'wrong'. I think HS makes some good products as does McMillan.
I once knew a guy that drove a Pinto Wagon 350,00 miles with no problems, go figger??
Carl

[high country]

I have 2 mc millans one is a mc swirly, one hs, and one b&c.

the mc millan is best on the fit/finish. I like the palm swell and sharp chekering.................but, if you are gonna drop that kind of $$ you are gonna bed it anyway. and mine does not scratch, it chips.

the hs offers good fit/finish for the $$ and for most guys that shoot only during hunting season they will be plenty happy with it. seems pertty tough as I am a hunter and treat my gus as tools, be they 500 or 5000 bucks.

my b&c is a model no longer available. it has the sling mounts built into the stock. I absolutely had to bed it and it did get pillars (all stacks should have them in my opinion) it required slightly more work than the others, is not as stiff it is lighter and like the hs, is a wee bit chubby.

now ont the ti stocks......I like them...alot.  good strength to weight, good price. the grip is a bit straighter then the others, but I think it points fast like a good shotgun. it is far and away my most carried rifle............but remember, everyone has their favorite. just build your own and who cares what anyone else thinks.

bottom line. each of them has a different feel, the quality does vary, but all should be worked anyhow.

[JoshT]

Whatever...

Compelling rebuttal... 

Horse to water... no need to argue. McM guys never listen... so I'll just keep killing stuff with my sup-par stocks. I guess my rifles shooting better in the HS stocks (than the 'profesionally fitted' McMillans)... holds no water in this argument.