Federal and State Wildlife Agencies Destroying our Elk

[Elkaholic daWg]

 Thanks  to an Old Friend that left  this Site a while back....


Ed Bangs: Well, we needed wolves that knew how to make a living in an area like Yellowstone National Park. And so we began to think about where to get wolves that would know what an elk is, how to find one, and how to kill one—and where to get wolves that are used to living in cold mountainous terrain. All you have to do is look north of the border and you find that next to Banff National Park in Alberta, and a little bit farther north in British Columbia, you have such wolves

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/nature/wolves-yellowstone.html



 PBS...wgbh Boston, so expect lies.

[Johnb317]

What a whitewash.  "the DNA is close"?   There has been considerable research about the origins of domestic dogs and wolves.   
The new journalism - ask only questions that support your position-  its the new science too.   The problem with all these people is they want things to be returned to what it was like before human encroachment, and that can't be done.   

Humans (and hunting) need to be in the equation. Very few wolf and tree huggers put their money into preservation of lands and wildlife.  They lobby for the govt to pay. 
Maybe we should do the same.   Wasn't it a hunter named teddy who started the national park system?

Sigh.   

[Bob33]

"And so we began to think about where to get wolves that would know what an elk is, how to find one, and how to kill one—"

Mission accomplished.

[Humptulips]

Amazing how facts get skewed. I don't think unintensionally either.
I read the interview from the link. In it Ed Bangs said there were 5 cattle and 5 sheep a year being lost to wolves.
From the USF&W own figures in the year of this interview, 1997, there were 22 cattle and 126 sheep that were confirmed wolf kills in the wolf recovery zones.
It would only go up from there, reaching a high of 944 confirmed wolf kills of domestic animals a year. Very important to note "confirmed wolf kills"

I wonder how his $19 million in additional economic activity because of wolves turned out?

[humanure]

Wasn't it a hunter named teddy who started the national park system?

It was Teddy who finally took the idea serious, but in reality, it was started by a small few, mostly spearheaded and conjured up originally by the great Aldo Leopold.

[GrainfedMuley]

Wasn't it a hunter named teddy who started the national park system?

It was Teddy who finally took the idea serious, but in reality, it was started by a small few, mostly spearheaded and conjured up originally by the great Aldo Leopold.

Blah, Blah, Blah...................

[dreamunelk]

Wasn't it a hunter named teddy who started the national park system?

It was Teddy who finally took the idea serious, but in reality, it was started by a small few, mostly spearheaded and conjured up originally by the great Aldo Leopold.

Wrong again!  The first national monument was Yellow Stone established by President Ulysses S. Grant.  Roosevelt took advantage of the antiquities act and established more.  So he did take it seriously.  However when this occurred Aldo Leopold was just starting his first year in college.

Aldo Leopold is responsible for establishing the North American model of Wildlife Management.  And wrote the first book on it.  While he was one of the first to realize that extirpating predators was a serious error.  He never once was against managing predator populations.

The Park System was established in 1916.  Aldo worked for the Forest Service at this time.

[humanure]

You are right on which president started it.

But even before his first year in college, Aldo had these idea's that people vastly disagreed with, but he shared them regardless because he felt in his heart was the best option for how things were going(he saw how things were gonna turn out. a man before his time). And yes, he was for predator management. I didn't dispute that. Sand County Almenac is a favorite book of mine.

[WAcoyotehunter]

You are right on which president started it.

But even before his first year in college, Aldo had these idea's that people vastly disagreed with, but he shared them regardless because he felt in his heart was the best option for how things were going(he saw how things were gonna turn out. a man before his time). And yes, he was for predator management. I didn't dispute that. Sand County Almenac is a favorite book of mine.

Aldo Leopold didn't have anything to do with the NPS.  He was certianly a visionary that understood natural systems and predator prey relationships.  I think he would be a little shocked to see our current problems.  The social aspect should never enter the equation.

[Elkaholic daWg]

Wasn't it a hunter named teddy who started the national park system?

It was Teddy who finally took the idea serious, but in reality, it was started by a small few, mostly spearheaded and conjured up originally by the great Aldo Leopold.

What does this have to do with wolves?

[WAcoyotehunter]

not much other than the park being ground zero for wolf recovery and being a 'test' for non human hunting wildlife management.

[humanure]

NPS were started because people like Leopold and others knew that if they didn't do something, the logging industry was gonna have their hands on all the forests and we would never have what we know as 'wild' life. If that had happened, hunting would have been terminated long ago and we would be seriously fuked beyond all hope. We truly would have become another England.

[Humptulips]

NPS were started because people like Leopold and others knew that if they didn't do something, the logging industry was gonna have their hands on all the forests and we would never have what we know as 'wild' life. If that had happened, hunting would have been terminated long ago and we would be seriously fuked beyond all hope. We truly would have become another England.

So the National Parks are the saviour of hunting.
That's certainly a different interpretation.

[humanure]

In a way, yes. It's the savior for a vast amount of things related to wildlife and the land we live in. I'm telling you, had it not been for the NPS.... *shudders* holy *censored* we would be so fuking eef'd. It would be worse than England/Ireland. I had friends from Ireland over a couple years ago, and before coming to my house, none of them had ever held a rifle in their lives. In fact, they got super freaked out because it's ILLEGAL to own firearms back in their home, and they thought they were about to be in trouble. That's what America would have been like without the NPS.

[Bob33]

NPS were started because people like Leopold and others knew that if they didn't do something, the logging industry was gonna have their hands on all the forests and we would never have what we know as 'wild' life. If that had happened, hunting would have been terminated long ago and we would be seriously fuked beyond all hope. We truly would have become another England.

We know that in spite of your protests to the contrary, you hate hunters.  Now you have added loggers to the list.  Please enlighten us: what is youe reference for claiming that national parks were developed as protection against logging?