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Author Topic: New Muzzleloader basics / 101  (Read 2107 times)

Offline lamrith

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New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« on: February 23, 2021, 06:07:37 PM »
Well my new muzzle stuffer is on the way.  I have bought a few pellets, bullets and primers that I found instock locally.  But the sheer volume of options for those, as well as the various items for using/loading/maintaining out there is eye opening.  Each brand seems to have it's idea of what each type of item should be as well.

I am curious what you pros take to range as well as (maybe more importantly?) what you use out in the field while hunting to load shoot and reload during a hunt.  supplies of many things are low/backorder but it would be great to hear from all of you what works, vs what is just not worth spending $0.01 on.

Thus my question.  Hopefully many of you answer so new ML owners have a place to read thru and avoid wasting money on junk and build themselves a good kit from the start.

If you were to put together YOUR perfect kit of essentials for a muzzle loader shooter to have what would it be? 

speed loaders, bullet starters, funnels, cleaning supplies, etc etc.  I thought I saw a speedloader a few years back that had a funnel build into it for loose powder but now....?
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Offline usmc74

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2021, 06:30:27 PM »
Welcome to the new money pit.  LOL

What Muzzy did you order?

For my use I prefer Powder rather than pellets (I use triple 7 3F loose powder)

My son and I hunted together for a week.  Same rifle/bullet and musket cap.  Mine fired at the end of the week, his pellets did not.

I carry 3 speed loaders with measured powder and bullet.

I REALLY like the Barnze TMZ 290.  The TEZ is almost the same but easier to load.  I have 2 one shot kills on elk.

Offline raydog

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2021, 07:17:49 PM »
I also use loose triple seven FFFg and Barnes TEZ. Excellent grouping and performance on elk. TMZs are just two snug for my Cvas. Personally havenít had the best results with pellets. I like peep sight much more than the standard factory sight. I carry a couple speed loaders with just powder and bullets, keep extra primers in a small ziplock in my front pants pocket. Here is a picture of the Barnes bullet I pulled from the hide

Offline lamrith

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2021, 07:51:19 PM »
I have a CVA Accura V2 stainless on the way, It comes setup for 209 primers.  I also bought BH209 breechplug and NW kit as added insurance given the wild availability of things.  Then I ordered a Eabco Peeprib, and lyman front globe setup.  yeah money pit is right!

I stopped at sportco sat and picked up some 777 50/50 pellets as well as some firestar pellets, some 300grb SST sabots and 209inline primers.  I want to go powder long term, but grabbed what was available for short term.  How is the 777 3F for fouling the bore? can you get many shots before having to clean?

What do you guys use for carrying your pre measured loads and anything special for loading into the gun in the field?  I could see trying to pour a powder charge in the field making a mess, especially in wet weather.  I have some pellets for now, as nobody seems to have powder anywhere.

What about bullet starting, carrying charges/speedloaders, etc etc..
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Offline raydog

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2021, 08:04:35 PM »
I wouldnít say itís the cleanest propellant out there! Seems like I have to clean every 3-4 shots or even the easy loading Barnes get a bit snug. Maybe Iím just picky.

I havenít had many issues pouring powder from my speed loader. Even after taking a shot at an elk. No funnel needed.

I also want to add that my issues with pellets were pre 209 legalization.

Offline callturner

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2021, 08:31:45 PM »
I am not pellet friendly, which means I do not know squat about them . Loose powder however I have some experience. If your not shooting BH209, use the standard breech plug. I personally have better luck with pyrodex select when not using BH209. I shoot Black crushrib Harvester sabot with a 300 gr Deep Curl Speer .452 bullet . With Blackhorn you will want the hotter shotgun 209s, not the ones made for muzzleloaders. 777 leaves a crud ring down where you seat your bullet that must be swabbed out before the next loading. I use 1 1/2 x 2 in patch's dampened with windex w/ ammonia to swab with . Once on each side of one then 1 dry. Not necessary with BH209.  , Ron Buggs is the VP of Harvester, Ph 800-922-6287 to order direct. Graffs are less expensive at times.

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Offline Bob33

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2021, 08:45:17 PM »
Speed loaders like this can help with field reloading. Load up a few with powder,  bullet, and primer and carry while hunting.
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Offline actionshooter

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2021, 08:48:53 PM »
On the maintenance side... keep that breech plug greased... always and then grease it some more   :chuckle:
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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2021, 08:49:10 PM »
I use the ribbed sabots and they are easier to load.  I can get 2-3 more shots before having to clean.  Saw one bull take 6 rounds a couple seasons ago.

Online Dan-o

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2021, 09:07:31 PM »
I use the ribbed sabots and they are easier to load.  I can get 2-3 more shots before having to clean.  Saw one bull take 6 rounds a couple seasons ago.

6 rounds?!?!?!?

One in each leg and one in the paunch before hitting the  vitals?
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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2021, 09:12:44 PM »
The guy said they were all in/near vitals. 

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2021, 09:58:32 PM »
No disrespect intended.

I've killed a lot of elk with muzzy, and my experience is that they don't go far with a  hole in their heart or both lungs.
They are tough creatures with a strong will to live, but without a heart or both lungs, they simply don't last long.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2021, 10:15:47 PM by Dan-o »
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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #12 on: February 23, 2021, 11:50:09 PM »
back on topic.

*  I tape a few 2" pieces  of electrical tape to the stock of my rifle.   They are completely out of the way, but in the event of bad weather, you can put a piece over your muzzle.    I have personally conducted accuracy tests with electrical tape over the muzzle,and get no difference in point of impact or accuracy of groups.

*  I also stole a bottle of my wife's clear nail polish years ago.   In really bad weather I will "paint" my musket cap on.   Dried acrylic nail polish makes a nice waterproof seal.

*  I keep a nipple pick handy .   They are small,and when you need one you really need  one.

*   I believe a small brass front bead is good for accuracy. Many come standard with a huge front bead.   Something like this:    https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1184127653?pid=319797

*  And I am a fan of a ghost ring rear sight with removable aperture with a brass ring.   Seems to provide best contrast/clarity for me.   Something like this,but the removable aperture has a brass ring.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1006000848?pid=661938

*  IDK what kind of ignition system you're getting,but if your choice is between number 11 caps and musket caps, look up the temperature and spark size of both and I bet you will switch to musket caps.

*  Someone already mentioned speedloaders.  They are a must.   A few come with waterproof spaces for caps.   If not, be sure to keep your caps waterproof somehow.

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Offline GWP

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #13 on: February 23, 2021, 11:55:29 PM »
I use the ribbed sabots and they are easier to load.  I can get 2-3 more shots before having to clean.  Saw one bull take 6 rounds a couple seasons ago.

There is a serious issue somewhere. Too far, poor accuracy, buck fever. Something.

Offline optic2

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #14 on: February 24, 2021, 05:05:49 AM »
Peeprib sight all the way. You are able to get a sight further back towards the breech and it includes a rail in case you want to hunt with a scope in a state they allow scopes or an area that modern firearms are not legal but muzzleloaders are (during modern firearm season).

Offline lamrith

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #15 on: February 24, 2021, 12:11:24 PM »
I keep hearing deep curl mentioned but have yet to find anyplace that has them available.  Same with BH209 powder or 209M primers right now.  I waited a few months too late to get rolling on a new addiction.

Yeah I bought a peeprib after hearing some people had issues with the wilson not adjusting high enough.

back on topic.

*  I tape a few 2" pieces  of electrical tape to the stock of my rifle.   They are completely out of the way, but in the event of bad weather, you can put a piece over your muzzle.    I have personally conducted accuracy tests with electrical tape over the muzzle,and get no difference in point of impact or accuracy of groups.

*  I also stole a bottle of my wife's clear nail polish years ago.   In really bad weather I will "paint" my musket cap on.   Dried acrylic nail polish makes a nice waterproof seal.

*  I keep a nipple pick handy .   They are small,and when you need one you really need  one.

*   I believe a small brass front bead is good for accuracy. Many come standard with a huge front bead.   Something like this:    https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1184127653?pid=319797

*  And I am a fan of a ghost ring rear sight with removable aperture with a brass ring.   Seems to provide best contrast/clarity for me.   Something like this,but the removable aperture has a brass ring.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1006000848?pid=661938

*  IDK what kind of ignition system you're getting,but if your choice is between number 11 caps and musket caps, look up the temperature and spark size of both and I bet you will switch to musket caps.

*  Someone already mentioned speedloaders.  They are a must.   A few come with waterproof spaces for caps.   If not, be sure to keep your caps waterproof somehow.
Good info!
As an answer to your question. "yes" is the ignition system I bought, the gun is 209 from the factory.  I also bought the BH209 breechplug as well as the old school NW legal ignition kit.  So bases are covered for ignition options.  The guy at Muzzleloader Supply on River Rd in Puyallup clued me in to getting NW type ignition as those primers are more available than 209's have been.
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Offline Damnimissed

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #16 on: February 24, 2021, 04:00:57 PM »
I use the ribbed sabots and they are easier to load.  I can get 2-3 more shots before having to clean.  Saw one bull take 6 rounds a couple seasons ago.

There is a serious issue somewhere. Too far, poor accuracy, buck fever. Something.

I shot a cow 4 times in the lungs with 300gr Knight Bloodlines and she didnít really flinch when Iíd shoot. Thought I was missing for a minute, then she tipped over dead as a door nail.

Offline haftard

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #17 on: February 24, 2021, 04:44:10 PM »
So ive been shooting a cva optima v2 for 3 years now and have killed 3 elk with this set up. Load it with 3 of the 777 50/50 pellets and 1 350g kight bloodline bullet. I think i use the winchester 209 primers.

At 13 yards the bullet preformed well and he was dead within the time it took me to reload.

At 140 yards the bullet preformed ... Ehh ... The peddles didnt get any penetration. But regardless he was dead within the time it took ,e to reload.

At 30 yards we didnt find any of the peddles they where all in his heart and lungs.

I use the williams peep sight and just a fiberoptic front sight that came with the gun.

My wife shoots the hornady sst... I can never remeber the grain but i always buy the right one. Im pretty sure its the 300g. They preform well. Onlu reason she dosnt shoot the blood lines is they dont load in her gun worth a damn. She has a cva wolf.
Put some blue locktight on your front sight cuz they do rattle loose. Personaly i dont use a bullet starter i just use my ram rod.
I run with 4 of the basic speed loaders for pellets. They are just a tube with caps on either end. I keep a hadfull of primers (between 10 and 20. In a baggie in my pack and like 5 in my pocket. I tend to lose more primers on the 209 primwe holder bs they sell at the store. And the baggies keep them dry. Even tho i havent had any issue with the floor bord primers just target shooting.
Lasty get a range finer, shoot often, be confident, know your range, know your limits, and have fun. When the smoke clears hopfuly you have alot more work to do.

Offline GWP

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #18 on: February 24, 2021, 04:50:39 PM »
I use the ribbed sabots and they are easier to load.  I can get 2-3 more shots before having to clean.  Saw one bull take 6 rounds a couple seasons ago.

There is a serious issue somewhere. Too far, poor accuracy, buck fever. Something.

I shot a cow 4 times in the lungs with 300gr Knight Bloodlines and she didnít really flinch when Iíd shoot. Thought I was missing for a minute, then she tipped over dead as a door nail.

Verified into or through the lungs? Enough time to reload 4 times? Wow!

Offline M_ray

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #19 on: February 24, 2021, 05:58:35 PM »
I have two TC's been doing this for 25 or more years now. I shoot triple 7 fffg powder, one gun 310grn full lead conical knight sabot bullet the other 250grn TC shockwave. Both I use #11 caps. I tried muskets once 10 years ago and they kept falling off and I got nervous that the slots in them would just be another spot for moisture to get in, my guns always go bang so no need to change.

In one pocket some extra caps and the other 2 speed loaders , in the pack a zip with some pre soaked cleaning pads a zip with some pre soaked bore butter pads a cleaning jag and a bullet puller. Never really needed them but a buddy has and after a 7 mile round trip back to the rig to get him stuff to clean with so he could keep his eye on a buck I decided to start carrying these things with me.

I never have to shoot more than once but I can load 6-8 times at the range without cleaning. If you are not able to get more than one or two bullets down the pipe then you are likely not burning all your powder. This is a downfall of pellets if your barrel would be the most accurate at 90 and your shooting 2 pellets then you may possibly be just throwing 10 grns of powder down the barrel on the ground unnecessarily fouling your barrel, You're also loosing money. You can test this by placing a tarp in front of your shooting bench and check it after the shot, some find unspent powder on the tarp. If so powder gives you the ability to work your load down pellets do not.   

If two pellets work accurately and you're able to load several then your on track and don't change a thing, good luck.  :tup:
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Offline BigTines

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #20 on: February 25, 2021, 11:24:00 AM »
Question from a newb to all the experts....

What do you guys do at the end of a hunting day? Reuse the load for the next day? Shoot out the bullet? Push it out(is the bullet reusable?)? If you reuse it for next day at what point do you get a fresh new load? End of the week?

Also does what you do depend on the weather? Ie if itís raining all day do you shoot it out and not if itís sunny?

Also do you put electrical tape over the end? Can you do that with a muzzleloader?

Not sure if it makes a difference but  Iím shooting an Accura v2 with BH209 and 209m primer and saboted Barnes Tez.

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #21 on: February 25, 2021, 11:34:47 AM »
Question from a newb to all the experts....

What do you guys do at the end of a hunting day? Reuse the load for the next day? Shoot out the bullet? Push it out(is the bullet reusable?)? If you reuse it for next day at what point do you get a fresh new load? End of the week?

Also does what you do depend on the weather? Ie if itís raining all day do you shoot it out and not if itís sunny?

Also do you put electrical tape over the end? Can you do that with a muzzleloader?

Not sure if it makes a difference but  Iím shooting an Accura v2 with BH209 and 209m primer and saboted Barnes Tez.
I leave it in for the entire season now.  I'm currently using an inline with the closed breech--bh209--209 primer, but I cover the end of the barrel with some plastic.  I just take the primer out at the end of the day.
When I used a sidelock with pyrodex powder, I'd have to shoot every day or every other day or it was a real gamble on it working.

Offline trophyhunt

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #22 on: February 25, 2021, 12:22:59 PM »
Pellets are fine, I've been shooting them for years with no problems.
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Offline haftard

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #23 on: February 25, 2021, 01:31:34 PM »
If it is a realy wet season i will unload and clean the gun every 3 days. I personaly do not tape the end of my barrel. Alot of people do. I just dont. If im hunting from home the gun comes in the house and out of the case every night. In camp i jusy leave it in the truck.

When i do unload the gun to clean it i dont reuse anything but the bullet(new sabot)

Offline M_ray

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #24 on: February 25, 2021, 01:46:33 PM »
Question from a newb to all the experts....

What do you guys do at the end of a hunting day? Reuse the load for the next day? Shoot out the bullet? Push it out(is the bullet reusable?)? If you reuse it for next day at what point do you get a fresh new load? End of the week?

Also does what you do depend on the weather? Ie if itís raining all day do you shoot it out and not if itís sunny?

Also do you put electrical tape over the end? Can you do that with a muzzleloader?

Not sure if it makes a difference but  Iím shooting an Accura v2 with BH209 and 209m primer and saboted Barnes Tez.

I leave mine loaded the entire season at the end if I havent shot it I push it out dump powder and use those bullets at the range. I always start a hunt with a fresh bullet. For got to mention in my post above yes I keep a couple pieces of electrical tape on my stock for heavy rain to cover my tip. if its light rain I'm usually keeping my muzzle down and covering my breech under my jacket anyway. when muzzy hunting I rarely shoulder my rifle but def not in the rain.
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Offline Fl0und3rz

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #25 on: February 25, 2021, 01:50:05 PM »
tagging along

Offline Guardhair

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #26 on: February 25, 2021, 02:02:24 PM »
  I always keep a few xtra caps in my snoose can. That way Iíll never be without either!

Offline pd

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #27 on: February 25, 2021, 02:13:16 PM »
Oh, and when you fill those speed loaders, make sure the cap you put inside is fresh (not used).

A "friend" told me about this.  Makes it darn hard to finish your hunt successfully if you ignore this advice. :bash:
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Offline Encore 280

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #28 on: February 25, 2021, 02:29:07 PM »
That's one reason why I like the 209s.  Don't have to be fresh. :tup:

Offline Damnimissed

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #29 on: February 27, 2021, 12:55:43 AM »
I use the ribbed sabots and they are easier to load.  I can get 2-3 more shots before having to clean.  Saw one bull take 6 rounds a couple seasons ago.

There is a serious issue somewhere. Too far, poor accuracy, buck fever. Something.

I shot a cow 4 times in the lungs with 300gr Knight Bloodlines and she didnít really flinch when Iíd shoot. Thought I was missing for a minute, then she tipped over dead as a door nail.

Verified into or through the lungs? Enough time to reload 4 times? Wow!

I just looked at the photo. It was 3 in the back of the lungs with it slightly quartered away and one in the front of the shoulder. Dead on her feet, really strange though.

Offline Wetwoodshunter

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Re: New Muzzleloader basics / 101
« Reply #30 on: March 03, 2021, 06:44:49 AM »
Man I am glad I found this thread before posting. I picked up a Remington Ultimate Mzloader yesterday and am going to have to figure it out before elk season. Should be plenty of time.

 


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[Today at 10:00:34 PM]


WTS First Lite Corrugate Foundary by Mossy
[Today at 09:56:56 PM]


WTT h1000 updated by Come Get Some
[Today at 09:45:12 PM]


Kodiak canvas 10x 10 great shape, only used a few times, no holes,tears or burns by Britt-dog
[Today at 09:26:34 PM]


Novagrade Digiscoping Adapter by johns8168
[Today at 09:23:24 PM]


Bow press options by Sutherland
[Today at 08:56:07 PM]


2021 Bears by trophyhunt
[Today at 08:30:18 PM]


DIY turret press by Norman89
[Today at 08:16:29 PM]


WTB stainless ruger 10/22 by bugs n bones
[Today at 08:03:50 PM]


FS or Trade 380 Hornady CD by emac
[Today at 07:28:37 PM]


2021 Turkeys!!! Let see those birds. by denali
[Today at 07:22:45 PM]


New X-bolt Hells Canyon Speed all set up by Westside88
[Today at 07:17:54 PM]


Garmin Rino 610 by Tball77
[Today at 07:11:14 PM]


Iso: sinclair nt die by 7mmlong
[Today at 06:54:31 PM]


WTB atv by Boss .300 winmag
[Today at 06:41:21 PM]


Coyote noses by Kain
[Today at 05:54:54 PM]


2021 sheds.... Post them here. by dmoua
[Today at 05:46:32 PM]


Trailer brake controller questions by BD1
[Today at 05:40:42 PM]