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Author Topic: rub question  (Read 5882 times)

Offline addicted2hunting

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rub question
« on: December 12, 2012, 12:36:00 PM »
when a blacktail rubs, is it truly in a line going from bed to feed? I hear mixed information on this... Also, how late in the season does a buck rub/maintain his rub?
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Offline headshot5

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Re: rub question
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2012, 12:41:21 PM »
Of course it is.  However, it does not mean it is a straight line or that he will come back at all. 

Offline bobcat

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Re: rub question
« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2012, 12:49:20 PM »
I can tell you from the trail cam videos that I recently got, that the main rubbing activity was from November 5th to the 12th. I had about 4 bucks visiting and rubbing the same 3 trees.

At this time of the season I don't believe these bucks are going to feed at all. I think they are only searching for does. But of course the does will be traveling to feeding areas so the bucks will follow them there.

I pulled my cam on December 2nd, so I have no information for after that. But the bucks totally quit visiting this site by November 18th.

Offline AOD

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Re: rub question
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2012, 01:57:48 PM »
Well the bucks at my place rubbed every single new tree planted this year! If they are in a straight line from where he beds he must sleep at the bottom of my pond. I usually think of blacktail rubs like a dog marking his territory. Every tree next to a trail or opening was rubbed. Still don't know why he busted up the magnolia trees in the front yard though....
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Offline lokidog

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Re: rub question
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2012, 02:07:39 PM »
Well the bucks at my place rubbed every single new tree planted this year! If they are in a straight line from where he beds he must sleep at the bottom of my pond. I usually think of blacktail rubs like a dog marking his territory. Every tree next to a trail or opening was rubbed. Still don't know why he busted up the magnolia trees in the front yard though....

Dang, SCUBA gear explains why you can't find the big ones.....   :chuckle:

Offline addicted2hunting

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Re: rub question
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2012, 03:26:52 PM »
yeah I know it isnt a straight line. It makes sense that he would just pick random trees as he wanders to feed. the rubs I found look fresh.
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Offline curlewkiller

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Re: rub question
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2012, 07:35:43 AM »
I agree with this, I think they use ground scrapes and branch marking for territory.

yeah I know it isnt a straight line. It makes sense that he would just pick random trees as he wanders to feed. the rubs I found look fresh.
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Offline Chesapeake

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Re: rub question
« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2012, 09:44:35 AM »
From what I've seen they pick locations based on relation and visibillity(scent or sight) to the areas the does frequent. (not sure how to convery what I mean in words).

For instance a place I was at this last week. There is a large clear cut now filled with 5 to 6 foot trees. It has a road up the middle and then a road along the large timber up one side. The roads make a pretty decent circle. Every 100 yards or so along both roads there was a rub. On the middle road it was the small firs. On the road along the big timber it was the alders in the ditch. The rubs continued off the end of the road out into the cut along the main trail in that direction.

I see this alot. Rubs just more or less randomly spread around the areas does frequent. Or along the top of a ridge, or down a finger ridge. Places of likely doe travel, good visibillity to areas does frequent, ect........

So maybe a buck would get up from bed and make rubs as he moved toward the areas the does feed, but It seems to me the rubs are more along the travel lanes the bucks take moving to and around the areas does frequent while they are cruising for does.

Doesnt seem to be a rub on your way to breakfast type deal, but I could see that interpretation given the bucks tend toward the areas the does feed, cause thats where the does are.

It also seems to me that if a rub is along a travel route and a buck passes, he may investigate and rub it more. His or not. But it doesnt seem that the bucks head out with the intent to revisit/refresh existing rubs, or that they purposefully maintain a "rub line". Seems to me its more a thing of oportunity.

 

Offline addicted2hunting

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Re: rub question
« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2012, 10:06:26 AM »
From what I've seen they pick locations based on relation and visibillity(scent or sight) to the areas the does frequent. (not sure how to convery what I mean in words).

For instance a place I was at this last week. There is a large clear cut now filled with 5 to 6 foot trees. It has a road up the middle and then a road along the large timber up one side. The roads make a pretty decent circle. Every 100 yards or so along both roads there was a rub. On the middle road it was the small firs. On the road along the big timber it was the alders in the ditch. The rubs continued off the end of the road out into the cut along the main trail in that direction.

I see this alot. Rubs just more or less randomly spread around the areas does frequent. Or along the top of a ridge, or down a finger ridge. Places of likely doe travel, good visibillity to areas does frequent, ect........

So maybe a buck would get up from bed and make rubs as he moved toward the areas the does feed, but It seems to me the rubs are more along the travel lanes the bucks take moving to and around the areas does frequent while they are cruising for does.

Doesnt seem to be a rub on your way to breakfast type deal, but I could see that interpretation given the bucks tend toward the areas the does feed, cause thats where the does are.

It also seems to me that if a rub is along a travel route and a buck passes, he may investigate and rub it more. His or not. But it doesnt seem that the bucks head out with the intent to revisit/refresh existing rubs, or that they purposefully maintain a "rub line". Seems to me its more a thing of oportunity.
very interesting.
"real dogs have beards"

Offline BOWHUNTER45

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Re: rub question
« Reply #9 on: December 13, 2012, 10:41:37 AM »
Straight line or line of travel or whatever you want to call it ... I have followed the same rub lines for years ..meaning the bucks in the particular area use the same patterns in the rut ..just like Bobcat showed ...different bucks will hit the same rub lines leaving their scent ..this late in season it is always tough .. and most likely they have quit horning up the trees...they have found themselves a thick brush pile to hide and fatten themselves up after the rut ..You need to just find that spot . I have photos of the same trees being rubbed for the last 5 years ...Same deer ? Nope ...I have killed 3 different bucks in the exact same area ..  :twocents: maybe I need to get out my video camera and take a little walk and explain what I am saying ... :tup:

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Re: rub question
« Reply #10 on: December 13, 2012, 10:44:46 AM »
make sure you show lots of identifying land marks when you do this.  :chuckle:
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Offline bow4elk

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Re: rub question
« Reply #11 on: December 13, 2012, 10:50:24 AM »
Rubs are made for different reasons but when it comes to the breeding cycle, or the rut, rubs play a signifcant role in social status for both bucks and does in any given area.  I contend that the "rut" kicks off the day bucks shed velvet which can be as early as late August but is typically the first week or so in September.  During the month of September bucks are still in their summer social groups and will hang together to feed and bed, and will often start light sparring and generally getting the hang for their new headgear.  This is the early stages of setting up the pecking order and it will ramp through October as more testosterone comes into play, causing the urge to breed.

There are rubs to shed velvet, there are signpost rubs that communicate social status, there are on-the-spot rubs to vent pent up frustration and angst, and there are rub concentrations in what I call "Rut Zones" that signify a frenzy of annual rutting activity, typically in the same areas annually (unless they get logged or developed!)

Here's my 6-part on post-season scouting (primarily for blacktails):
http://www.outdoorblog.net/pnwbowhunting/2011/04/05/deer-post-season-scouting-6-part-series/

I put this video clip together last year to help shed some light on the topic.  Hope you find it helpful.

Blacktail Rubbing, Forehead Gland Scent
« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 12:15:33 PM by bow4elk »
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Offline Chesapeake

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Re: rub question
« Reply #12 on: December 13, 2012, 02:26:01 PM »
There are rubs to shed velvet, there are signpost rubs that communicate social status, there are on-the-spot rubs to vent pent up frustration and angst, and there are rub concentrations in what I call "Rut Zones" that signify a frenzy of annual rutting activity, typically in the same areas annually (unless they get logged or developed!)


I think this hits on my observations.  I hunt industiral timber lands in SW Washington. The landcape and areas the does use constantly change. While you may very well find deer hitting the same areas along the same trials year after year if that place remains timbered. For the most part the feed areas for the does change every few years and the "rut zones" change with them. In the areas where food source remains stationary they seem to rub in the same areas year after year.

I've put a few cams up on rubs over the years. Its pretty cool to see who is doing the rubbing, but often they never return. Must have got one of the "on the spot" rubs. I threw out the whole large tree large deer, small tree small deer idea years ago. Now days I look for collateral damage on surounding limbs and bushes to try and figure out just how big the buck is.

Trail cameras will really change your perspective on blacktails.





Offline addicted2hunting

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Re: rub question
« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2012, 03:18:03 PM »
Rubs are made for different reasons but when it comes to the breeding cycle, or the rut, rubs play a signifcant role in social status for both bucks and does in any given area.  I contend that the "rut" kicks off the day bucks shed velvet which can be as early as late August but is typically the first week or so in September.  During the month of September bucks are still in their summer social groups and will hang together to feed and bed, and will often start light sparring and generally getting the hang for their new headgear.  This is the early stages of setting up the pecking order and it will ramp through October as more testosterone comes into play, causing the urge to breed.

There are rubs to shed velvet, there are signpost rubs that communicate social status, there are on-the-spot rubs to vent pent up frustration and angst, and there are rub concentrations in what I call "Rut Zones" that signify a frenzy of annual rutting activity, typically in the same areas annually (unless they get logged or developed!)

Here's my 6-part on post-season scouting (primarily for blacktails):
http://www.outdoorblog.net/pnwbowhunting/2011/04/05/deer-post-season-scouting-6-part-series/

I put this video clip together last year to help shed some light on the topic.  Hope you find it helpful.

Blacktail Rubbing, Forehead Gland Scent
wow, hey thanks for all that info!
"real dogs have beards"

Offline addicted2hunting

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Re: rub question
« Reply #14 on: December 13, 2012, 03:18:49 PM »
Thanks for the info guys.
"real dogs have beards"

 


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