Who's applying? WDFW hiring 2 more wolf trappers.

[jackelope]

Carter Niemeyer is probably responsible  for the most wolves trapped and/or killed in the lower 48 I bet. If not the most, then close. Do you know about him, Special T?? You should go ahead and do a little googling and read up. Be careful what you wish for. I betcha he's got a degree too. 

[wolfbait]

Carter Niemeyer is probably responsible  for the most wolves trapped and/or killed in the lower 48 I bet. If not the most, then close. Do you know about him, Special T?? You should go ahead and do a little googling and read up. Be careful what you wish for. I betcha he's got a degree too.

Carter Niemeyer is probably responsible for several wolf releases in Wa and OR. He is also a fraud when it comes to wolves. He would rather protect them then tell the truth, he promoted them on the lies of David Mech, remember the lies of David Meck. Jack?  The lies that wolves proved he was a liar?

I would have to agree with Special T, WDFW have to advertise the job, and just like they have to have meetings across the country it's all BS. They already have someone or no one lined up for the job, perhaps either you or WAcoyote will get it. It won't go to someone who hasn't been already brainwashed.

 I don't think you want us to start out recalling your famous Carter do you?  Mech is bad enough, which camera do I lie too Mech::::::::How do you spell Fraud starting with WDFW?

[jackelope]

Oh hes not my Carter, nor do i like the guy or what he does.  Special T said he wanted an experienced trapper on board with WDFW. I referenced Niemeyer and told him to be careful what he wished for. It's right there in plain English, Wolfbait. Not sure how or if you missed what I was saying or if you're just pulling your usual attempts at putting words in my mouth.  Not sure why you feel the constant need to do that. It makes you look bad.

[bobcat]

Of course the WDFW has to advertise the jobs. And if they do already have people in mind for those jobs, so what? Yes, that is how the system works, sometimes. But all this talk about what they really need to do, or how they lied about this or that, is nothing but speculation. Why all the speculation from those who really have no clue about this? Seriously, if you think you can do so much better than the people currently employed by the WDFW, then why not go to work for them and prove it to us?

[Special T]

I made a couple of assumptions with my previous statement that I may now regret. 1 I assume that it is the goal to document as many wolf packs as possible. That is what the WDFW says they want. 2 I assume that an experienced trapper would not have most of their experience in catch and release trapping. They would be a trapper that has done it for fur, and conflict resolution.

I think my 1st assumption is the reason why we are at odds. Carter may have the chops for the 2nd assumption But I'm not so sure about the 1st assumption. That is even if the real goal is quick total documentation.

Many jump on Scott Fitken for his deception about the real numbers in his area. It MAY not be all his doing, it MAY be what his bosses want and he is just the face that we have for the deception we have witnessed.

So we MAY have a trapper or 2 with the chopps to catch lots of wolves, that i don't know... But what i can tell you is we DON'T have the trappers AND the honest desire to documents all the packs as quickly as possible... How can i make this statement? Experience. The WDFW has been offered help and has refused it because it was not one of their employees. When given credible sightings, as explained here and elsewhere, they have blown the observer off instead of investigating further. Photos, descriptions, exact locations weren't enough for serious follow up IF they weren't in an area that they wanted to look.

IF i was in charge of getting the wolves documented ASAP what kinds of things would i do? I would ask the public for help. I would put forth the kinds of requirements that were needed for the agencies limited resources to make investigations. I would have looked at making a sighting map for the state MUCH earlier than has happened now so that we  could find wolves that were not right next to each other.. I might enlist the help of Tribes or ANY OTHER GROUP that could help in live trapping and documenting the location and kinds of wolves...

I think it is impossible to say for certain what individuals motives are, however the individuals, AND agency ACTIONS tell us alot. The actions, or lack there of does NOT point to the speedy documentation of as many wolves as possible.

[wolfbait]

Of course the WDFW has to advertise the jobs. And if they do already have people in mind for those jobs, so what? Yes, that is how the system works, sometimes. But all this talk about what they really need to do, or how they lied about this or that, is nothing but speculation. Why all the speculation from those who really have no clue about this? Seriously, if you think you can do so much better than the people currently employed by the WDFW, then why not go to work for them and prove it to us?

Speculation?

Bobcat, you are funny as hell, it appears you don't have a clue yet.

The wolves that the USFWS and WDFW released in WA will never be controlled by hunting as a big game animal. It took years of trapping, poisoning and shooting to get the wolves out in the first place.
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'if you think you can do so much better than the people currently employed by the WDFW, then why not go to work for them and prove it to us?"

I work for the game herds and livestock Bobcat, WDFW don't like the Honest part of my job>such as people calling them out on their wolf releases, lack of confirmed packs and confirmed wolf attacks,  I'm quite sure I would be the last one on their list.
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As far as WDFW hiring me or anyone else except of course the all ready brainwashed there isn't a chance. The USFWS and WDFW want to keep all their little ducks lined out.

What we are hearing from WDFW is just more blow-by. The same chit just a different way

Wolf pack, BP confimations are a top down management problem-that we are working on now.
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Jack, I think I saved several of your messages from 09-10 Are you sure you don't want to change the part about me putting words in your. mouth?  Or would you just rather delete the thread 

[waterdoctor]

I was not going to post about what I know and knew about the two jobs that are posted.  First off I was sent the posting from the HR person in F&W via an e-mail on the 2nd.  Why? I think that they wanted me to apply.  Why?  Maybe my statement at the meeting the 27th was too close to the truth, I do not know.  The job is a union job, so the job description and qualifications are contractual.  The jobs are for only 6 months.  They would like some one that knows how to trap but they want some one to spend time determining the pack locations and setting up game cams so they can get pictures of the wolf pups so that they can work within their recovery plan.  If they want to get collars on the wolves my guess is that they will get Paul Frame to do it.  He did trap two wolves in a day in the wedge so he must not be too bad or the wedge wolves were really dumb.  If they just wanted to trap the wolves the cheapest way would be to contract with ADC, those trappers know how to trap wolves.  As to us helping with the locations and number of packs.  I tried to set up a little class on field documentation of tracks and other things so that the information would be defensible and of value.  Well the 27th we did not have much of a turn out.  No show, no hope.   Also there are members of staff of F&W that have not drank the cool aid on wolves are good and fine.   They get beat up by their boss's and us the public. 

[Special T]

Of course the WDFW has to advertise the jobs. And if they do already have people in mind for those jobs, so what? Yes, that is how the system works, sometimes. But all this talk about what they really need to do, or how they lied about this or that, is nothing but speculation. Why all the speculation from those who really have no clue about this? Seriously, if you think you can do so much better than the people currently employed by the WDFW, then why not go to work for them and prove it to us?

Posting a job description with the new employee happens all the time. Usually the job description is tailored to the individual in mind. I've seen it happen first hand in the Public school system, so its not a stretch.

[Special T]

I was not going to post about what I know and knew about the two jobs that are posted.  First off I was sent the posting from the HR person in F&W via an e-mail on the 2nd.  Why? I think that they wanted me to apply.  Why?  Maybe my statement at the meeting the 27th was too close to the truth, I do not know.  The job is a union job, so the job description and qualifications are contractual.  The jobs are for only 6 months.  They would like some one that knows how to trap but they want some one to spend time determining the pack locations and setting up game cams so they can get pictures of the wolf pups so that they can work within their recovery plan.  If they want to get collars on the wolves my guess is that they will get Paul Frame to do it.  He did trap two wolves in a day in the wedge so he must not be too bad or the wedge wolves were really dumb.  If they just wanted to trap the wolves the cheapest way would be to contract with ADC, those trappers know how to trap wolves.  As to us helping with the locations and number of packs.  I tried to set up a little class on field documentation of tracks and other things so that the information would be defensible and of value.  Well the 27th we did not have much of a turn out.  No show, no hope.   Also there are members of staff of F&W that have not drank the cool aid on wolves are good and fine.   They get beat up by their boss's and us the public.

I agree that the employees are in a catch 22. Maybe if they spoke up in some way this problem could be resolved. While the criticism may not be entirely fair, the employees that DO NOT speak out are doing nothing to make things right. I personally understand the need to protect ones job by not making a scene, and by not standing up they ARE deserving of at least some of the negativity the WDFW gets.

If WE want to make a difference who can we go to? How do we determine who from the WDFW has drank the cool-aid? How do we know who has the influence to buck those who have not? There are members here who HAVE good info, and HAVE made it known and bet blown off....   Trust is what is lacking and as we all know it is harder to earn back than to loose in the first place.

[JLS]

So once again a thread boils down to accusations of lies, releases, and WDFW employees not speaking up and taking a stand.  If all this expose is there in black and white, why has it not been released to us cave dwellers that are living in the dark?

All this conspiracy theory continues to perpetuated, but never substantiated.

[Curly]

, ill have the BS degree in a month but dont have any experience tranq'ing wolves and think i missed the spot on the app process to put in a cover letter and didnt realize that until just now reading the pdf posted here.

Closing Date/Time: Wed. 04/10/13 11:59 PM Pacific Time

uh870, I think you should see about submitting a new application with a cover letter included this time.  Since the Closing date is on Wednesday, you should be able to get that cover letter submitted in time. 

BTW - UplandHunter870, I bet you have a real shot at the position since you will have a Bachelor's degree shortly.  Just get that cover letter prepared and explain that you have lots of experience being in the woods and such.  (It sure would be nice getting someone in there who is a hunter)

[waterdoctor]

I agree that the employees are in a catch 22. Maybe if they spoke up in some way this problem could be resolved. While the criticism may not be entirely fair, the employees that DO NOT speak out are doing nothing to make things right. I personally understand the need to protect ones job by not making a scene, and by not standing up they ARE deserving of at least some of the negativity the WDFW gets.

If WE want to make a difference who can we go to? How do we determine who from the WDFW has drank the cool-aid? How do we know who has the influence to buck those who have not? There are members here who HAVE good info, and HAVE made it known and bet blown off....   Trust is what is lacking and as we all know it is harder to earn back than to loose in the first place.

I the meeting in Colville on the 27th Dave Ware cut very one on his staff off when asked if they support the wolves.   

How you find out who has not taken a drink takes time, also it will be driven by questions that they ask you.  They don't trust us much ether right now.  They will never make a statement that could find its way onto a site like this or the papers that could get them fired. 

As to the good information, yes we know that we saw a wolf or heard one but how was it presented? how was it documented? was it something that a guy could go out on a limb with his boss and say we need to divert time, people and money to this area?  That is why I am trying to get some information out to the guys here so that we can appear to have our stuff in one sock when we give the bio's a call.  Based on my experience about one in 10 to 1 in 20 reports are actionable.  Some are days after the fact, some have poor information on where it was (the locals know just where it is but staff working on it doesn't have a clue.), the pictures do not have time-date-location-person detailed in the picture and their is a boot or a hand in the picture for scale instead of a ruler or square that is in CM's or inches.   

[bobcat]

Of course the WDFW has to advertise the jobs. And if they do already have people in mind for those jobs, so what? Yes, that is how the system works, sometimes. But all this talk about what they really need to do, or how they lied about this or that, is nothing but speculation. Why all the speculation from those who really have no clue about this? Seriously, if you think you can do so much better than the people currently employed by the WDFW, then why not go to work for them and prove it to us?

Posting a job description with the new employee happens all the time. Usually the job description is tailored to the individual in mind. I've seen it happen first hand in the Public school system, so its not a stretch.

I agree with that, and I don't believe I have said otherwise. And again, if that is the case, I don't see why that's an issue. 

[Special T]

So once again a thread boils down to accusations of lies, releases, and WDFW employees not speaking up and taking a stand.  If all this expose is there in black and white, why has it not been released to us cave dwellers that are living in the dark?

All this conspiracy theory continues to perpetuated, but never substantiated.

If you had some "concrete" evidence such as video and such, or other hard evidence such as a plethora of eye witnesses, or some one involved, How could you bring it out?
You could take it to the WDFW so they could do the right thing?
You could take it to the media?
You could take it to your State Rep?

Unfortunately just having good info is NOT enough Especially if the motives are suspect. Why you might ask... I would assume that If you had evidence that contradicted what the WDFW you would want to affect some real change by releasing it. Isolating the event to a single employee, or an "unfortunate event" that has already been corrected. I don't think you need to wear a  to run down the different options of "what ifs" in a given scenario... 

[bobcat]

If you had some "concrete" evidence such as video and such, or other hard evidence such as a plethora of eye witnesses, or some one involved, How could you bring it out?

Evidence of what?