BC Wolf & Cougar Reduction: To Benefit Recovery of Mountain Caribou

[Sitka_Blacktail]

Never seen a caribou licking fertilizer in the ditches. And never claimed to be an expert.  I just pass on expert information and my opinion of what it means.

translation:


You have zero experience or personal knowledge so you latch on to tidbits of internet information that you want to believe then you put your personal spin on it.


I knew it all along but thanks for the confirmation.

Wait, what is your "expertise" again Dr KF Hunter?  Talk about a spin Dr.

[Elkaholic daWg]

Never seen a caribou licking fertilizer in the ditches. And never claimed to be an expert.  I just pass on expert information and my opinion of what it means.

translation:


You have zero experience or personal knowledge so you latch on to tidbits of internet information that you want to believe then you put your personal spin on it.


I knew it all along but thanks for the confirmation.

Wait, what is your "expertise" again Dr KF Hunter?  Talk about a spin Dr.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm/
 Hoquiam??   Wedge?  Lets see........................ Who has dealt with wolves................and has spent the most time in Lower  Eastern BC?     I gotta go with the guy from Orient

[Bob33]

There are posts on this thread that violate forum rules. Personal attacks will not be tolerated.

Please keep comments relevant to the topic, and not directed at individuals.

[KFhunter]

Never seen a caribou licking fertilizer in the ditches. And never claimed to be an expert.  I just pass on expert information and my opinion of what it means.

translation:


You have zero experience or personal knowledge so you latch on to tidbits of internet information that you want to believe then you put your personal spin on it.


I knew it all along but thanks for the confirmation.

Wait, what is your "expertise" again Dr KF Hunter?  Talk about a spin Dr.

If the day comes when I loose a debate then I'll be happy I've learned something,  I won't go out a sore looser.

I don't recall ever having lost an argument, mainly because if I'm not comfortable I don't enter the debate in the first place.
Also not having a particular agenda helps in that I'm not constrained by ideology, so you'll always loose if you enter the ring with me.


 


I jest, relax I'm not that boastful 

[idaho guy]

I dont even hunt in washington but waste a lot of time on this site! interesting stuff. I cant stand it and have to weigh in with some stuff no bioligist has probably written articles on.  Kf hunter and bear paw are right. Most of the endangered species, wolf reintrouction have very little to do with the particular species from the liberal view point. You can argue habitat vs predator all day long. The liberal agenda is to keep any man from doing anything ever in the woods. wether it is hunting or cutting a piece of firewood. The liberals that want wolves not logging etc etc etc. really just dont want people in the woods doing anything. I believe most of them live in the city and spend very little time in the real woods besides nature hikes on vacation. They believe the wilderness exists outside of where people should be and dont understand that man has been in the woods since the beginning. Also hunters, outdoorsman even loggers doing it right have been good stewards of the outdoors and wildlife and that is why we have an abundance of wildlife that we didnt have years ago. The wolf is just a way to remove those surplus numbers and reduce or eliminate us from hunting and the outdoors.And no I dont think we need to kill every wolf in the lower 48 just a lot more of them. Hunters fighting over loss of habitat or how to manage or ignore wolves is the liberals dream.                 

[KFhunter]

I dont even hunt in washington but waste a lot of time on this site! interesting stuff. I cant stand it and have to weigh in with some stuff no bioligist has probably written articles on.  Kf hunter and bear paw are right. Most of the endangered species, wolf reintrouction have very little to do with the particular species from the liberal view point. You can argue habitat vs predator all day long. The liberal agenda is to keep any man from doing anything ever in the woods. wether it is hunting or cutting a piece of firewood. The liberals that want wolves not logging etc etc etc. really just dont want people in the woods doing anything. I believe most of them live in the city and spend very little time in the real woods besides nature hikes on vacation. They believe the wilderness exists outside of where people should be and dont understand that man has been in the woods since the beginning. Also hunters, outdoorsman even loggers doing it right have been good stewards of the outdoors and wildlife and that is why we have an abundance of wildlife that we didnt have years ago. The wolf is just a way to remove those surplus numbers and reduce or eliminate us from hunting and the outdoors.And no I dont think we need to kill every wolf in the lower 48 just a lot more of them. Hunters fighting over loss of habitat or how to manage or ignore wolves is the liberals dream.                 

 

Don't forget cattle grazing too, that's a biggie.

[Elkaholic daWg]

  Winners! WINNERS!!!

[turkeyfeather]

If the day comes when I loose a debate then I'll be happy I've learned something,  I won't go out a sore looser.

I don't recall ever having lost an argument, mainly because if I'm not comfortable I don't enter the debate in the first place.
Also not having a particular agenda helps in that I'm not constrained by ideology, so you'll always loose if you enter the ring with me.


 

Great philosophy!    I try to live by that but sometimes I can't help myself and bite off more than I can chew. 

[KFhunter]

If the day comes when I loose a debate then I'll be happy I've learned something,  I won't go out a sore looser.

I don't recall ever having lost an argument, mainly because if I'm not comfortable I don't enter the debate in the first place.
Also not having a particular agenda helps in that I'm not constrained by ideology, so you'll always loose if you enter the ring with me.


 

Great philosophy!    I try to live by that but sometimes I can't help myself and bite off more than I can chew. 

That was all BS  BTW   
I'd like it to be true, and sometimes it is but no one is infallible.

[AspenBud]

I dont even hunt in washington but waste a lot of time on this site! interesting stuff. I cant stand it and have to weigh in with some stuff no bioligist has probably written articles on.  Kf hunter and bear paw are right. Most of the endangered species, wolf reintrouction have very little to do with the particular species from the liberal view point. You can argue habitat vs predator all day long. The liberal agenda is to keep any man from doing anything ever in the woods. wether it is hunting or cutting a piece of firewood. The liberals that want wolves not logging etc etc etc. really just dont want people in the woods doing anything. I believe most of them live in the city and spend very little time in the real woods besides nature hikes on vacation. They believe the wilderness exists outside of where people should be and dont understand that man has been in the woods since the beginning. Also hunters, outdoorsman even loggers doing it right have been good stewards of the outdoors and wildlife and that is why we have an abundance of wildlife that we didnt have years ago. The wolf is just a way to remove those surplus numbers and reduce or eliminate us from hunting and the outdoors.And no I dont think we need to kill every wolf in the lower 48 just a lot more of them. Hunters fighting over loss of habitat or how to manage or ignore wolves is the liberals dream.                 

I can think of more than a few Conservative minded people that fit that description. They live in the city as well.

People eating wolf poop and getting tape worms, stories of the UN releasing wolves in the woods airlifted in by black helicopter, and Red Riding Hood stories...those are a wolf lover's dream come true.

[idaho guy]

[               
[
I can think of more than a few Conservative minded people that fit that description. They live in the city as well.

People eating wolf poop and getting tape worms, stories of the UN releasing wolves in the woods airlifted in by black helicopter, and Red Riding Hood stories...those are a wolf lover's dream come true.

Yep, liberal was wrong description-meant so called radical "enviromentalist" I guess. Maybe tree hugger,greenie whatever not liberal politically. Wth is the stuff about black helicopters and eating poop?

[AspenBud]

Wth is the stuff about black helicopters and eating poop?

There are a lot of meaningless posts here about diseases and government conspiracies that generally distract from facts that people less knowledgeable about the problem would listen to. People "in the city" already think of paranoid people, militias, and the unabomber when you talk eastern WA, Idaho, and Montana, better to not stoke that impression further.

Was not aiming that at you. Just generally editorializing.

[idaho guy]

Ok thanks aspenbud-Dont want you to think I am paranoid but the tapeworm wolves carry is real and can be transmitted to people. I dont know of anyone who has eaten wolf poop though. When I took the Idaho wolf trapping class it kinda freaked me out with all the precautions they wanted you to take. Also I wasnt implying that everyone living in the city is all for the radical environment stuff-lots of great outdoorsman live in a big city to pay the bills. Just dont think the people pushing this garbage have spent much time in the woods to even know how it works. Its official wasted 2 hours on huntwa again. Dang needed to get some work done.

[Bob33]

Its official wasted 2 hours on huntwa again.

[bearpaw]

http://www.foundationforwildlifemanagement.org/Recommendations_Predator-Prey_Management_Final.pdf

Recommendations for Predator-Prey Management to Benefit the Recovery of Mountain Caribou in British Columbia

Prepared by:
Steven F. Wilson, Ph.D., R.P.Bio.,

Prepared for:
BC Ministry of Environment, Victoria

Executive Summary

On 16 October 2007, the BC government announced its endorsement of an implementation plan for mountain caribou recovery. The plan included several commitments, including managing predator and primary prey populations to reduce predation pressure in areas where predators are preventing caribou recovery. The purpose of this report is to recommend a framework for predator-prey management in support of mountain caribou recovery efforts in British Columbia.

The government-appointed Mountain Caribou Science Team was very clear that without immediate action to reverse population declines by reducing predation losses, some mountain caribou herds could be extirpated before the benefits of other management actions are realized. Therefore, it is imperative that the intensity of predator-prey management actions be scaled to the relative risk facing different mountain caribou herds.

Wolf predation is considered the major factor limiting the growth of caribou populations in North America and there is ample evidence that reductions in wolf populations can result in immediate and dramatic increases in caribou populations. The role of other predators in limiting caribou is less clear; however, high cougar abundance was correlated with a large decline in mountain caribou abundance in the South Purcells in the late 1990’s.

The following are recommended principles to guide predator management:

1. wolves and cougars will be the focus of predator management to benefit mountain caribou;
2. actions to benefit mountain caribou will be balanced against conservation objectives related to wolves and cougars; and,
3. wolf and cougar management will vary with the risk to mountain caribou herds. Grizzly and black bears are also important predators throughout mountain caribou range; however, reducing the risk of predation posed by bears would require either large-scale reductions, or the identification of individual problem bears, both of which are difficult. As a result, bears will continue to pose a mortality risk to mountain caribou, which will reduce the effectiveness of other predator management actions.

Based on available literature and data, predator densities in mountain caribou range and in the surrounding “matrix” habitat should average <6.5 wolves/1000 km2 and <10 cougar/1000 km2 and in most areas should be much lower, depending on the size and trend of mountain caribou herds. Other studies have indicated that only very aggressive reductions of 80% or more of the wolf population will
result in immediate, positive responses by mountain caribou populations. Even this level of reduction might not result in responses similar to those observed elsewhere because of the role of bear predation.

Removal of all resident packs and/or individuals is a legitimate goal where even rare predation events would further jeopardize the viability of a caribou herd. Sterilization of alpha male and female wolves might also be effective in reducing the growth rate of resident packs.

Regulated hunting and trapping will not be sufficient to reduce wolves to target densities. Hired trappers can be more effective but many biologists doubt that recovery objectives can be met without resorting to shooting wolves from helicopters, which they consider to be the most effective and humane approach. In contrast, cougars can be well-regulated by conventional hunting techniques.

Predator-Prey Management to Benefit Mountain Caribou Recovery ii

In the long term, caribou persistence will likely require reducing prey abundance within and adjacent to mountain caribou range, otherwise, predator reductions will need to be ongoing and intense. Based on the outcomes of a workshop in January 2008 ungulate and caribou biologists deemed it possible to reduce moose to reduce wolf carrying capacity. But biologists concluded that the population of white-tailed deer in southern BC is too large and resilient to be effectively reduced; therefore, high hunting pressure on cougars will need to be maintained indefinitely.

Biologists expressed concern about the northward expansion of deer and cougars and the subsequent effect on mountain caribou. As a result, they recommended that deer should be prevented from increasing where populations are currently low.

The following are recommended principles to guide the implementation of primary prey management:

1. moose will be the focus of prey reductions to benefit mountain caribou;
2. moose reductions to benefit mountain caribou will be balanced against moose conservation and use objectives;
3. moose targets will fall within the bounds generally expected under a natural disturbance regime; and,
4. deer populations should be prevented from increasing, where feasible. There are several methods that can be used to inform moose density targets: a review of wolf and moose densities observed in other jurisdictions; static biomass-based equations; dynamic modelling; and, habitat
analyses based on natural disturbance return intervals. Analyses based on available data suggest that target densities of 50-300 moose/1000 km2 would benefit mountain caribou recovery, depending on the circumstances of individual caribou herds.

Reducing moose to benefit mountain caribou has a strong theoretical basis, but it has not been tested experimentally. Trials are underway in two mountain caribou planning units and future decisions need to be informed by the outcomes of these trials. It may be necessary to initiate reductions in other areas where mountain caribou are most at risk, before results of the trials are known.

The relationships between management action outcomes and mountain caribou herd sizes and trends will be the basis for assessing the effectiveness of the predator-prey strategy. The Ministry of Environment has established specific population goals for mountain caribou and evaluation of the programme should be based on the soonest-available caribou data following implementation of predator-prey management actions.

More here:  http://www.foundationforwildlifemanagement.org/Recommendations_Predator-Prey_Management_Final.pdf