HB 1119 Hunter Education (Fees, Minimum Age)

[Bob33]

So from my experience, and maybe this isn't relevant to this thread, but my biggest gripe is that they require students to handle full size shotguns and rifles. I'm not sure why the students can't use the same size firearms that they would be using if they were to go hunting.
hunted with 22 rifles. Why is it assumed that everyone with a hunting license will be needing a 20 gauge shotgun and a 243?

The "they" is not WDFW.  There is nothing in the policy that specifies the size of firearms. Our course has youth sized firearms available for students.

[ghosthunter]

I think a minimum age of eight would be reasonable, for taking the hunter education course. It seems that it would be a good idea and would eliminate some of the issues.

My daughter was eight last summer when I enrolled her in the class. She was not able to finish the class, as a result of her small size.

So from my experience, and maybe this isn't relevant to this thread, but my biggest gripe is that they require students to handle full size shotguns and rifles. I'm not sure why the students can't use the same size firearms that they would be using if they were to go hunting.

I wanted to take my daughter grouse hunting, and I had bought her a single shot 22 rifle that was short and extremely light, only 2 1/2 pounds. She was totally capable of handling and shooting that particular gun safely.

But in the class they had shotguns and rifles that were of a size and weight that were more appropriate for adults. This makes zero sense to me. The instructor told me that they don't know what firearms the students will be using in the future so they need to be sure the student is proficient with everything. Kind of makes sense, sure, but doesn't size matter? If you're teaching a child how to ride a bicycle, do you give them an adult sized bicycle?

It just seemed unfair to me how they discriminate based on size of the student. I just don't understand why it wouldn't make sense to use different size guns for different size people?

Anyway, how about a change in the law to accommodate smaller children? This state does have small game and grouse that can be hunted with 22 rifles. Why is it assumed that everyone with a hunting license will be needing a 20 gauge shotgun and a 243?

There is no requirement that any student must fire a firearm. Instructors who at range days who are forcing any student to live fire who doesn't wish too with the threat of failure are violating the policy manual and should be reported to the Hunter Ed Unit.

Now having said that. , Most classes are using state guns, youth models. An in my opinion student should be able to handle youth size firearms.
Crickets .22 are not youth size.
I bring in a mixture of my guns and State youth guns so that adults and youth to  handle.

If it were up to me every student would be required to fire a youth model firearm. But that is not the case and the reason I do not do Range Days any more.

[Hi-Liter]

I took my son up to Sultan boys and girls club in Apr. 2014. I sat with him for the entire 3 day course. I registered him when he was 7. He had just turned 8 graduated from the course only 5 days after his 8 bday. The instructors liked him a lot. We both hunt ducks together and he loves it.

[fair-chase]

There is no requirement that any student must fire a firearm. Instructors who at range days who are forcing any student to live fire who doesn't wish too with the threat of failure are violating the policy manual and should be reported to the Hunter Ed Unit.

Now having said that. , Most classes are using state guns, youth models. An in my opinion student should be able to handle youth size firearms.
Crickets .22 are not youth size.
I bring in a mixture of my guns and State youth guns so that adults and youth to  handle.

If it were up to me every student would be required to fire a youth model firearm. But that is not the case and the reason I do not do Range Days any more.

Could have fooled me. I've sat in on 3 classes in the past 5 years and every one of them required shooting to pass the class. You didn't have to shoot accurately, but you did have to shoot. Furthermore, what is the purpose of having online students attend a range day if not for requiring them to shoot?

[Bob33]

Live fire is not mandatory.

[ghosthunter]

There is no requirement that any student must fire a firearm. Instructors who at range days who are forcing any student to live fire who doesn't wish too with the threat of failure are violating the policy manual and should be reported to the Hunter Ed Unit.

Now having said that. , Most classes are using state guns, youth models. An in my opinion student should be able to handle youth size firearms.
Crickets .22 are not youth size.
I bring in a mixture of my guns and State youth guns so that adults and youth to  handle.

If it were up to me every student would be required to fire a youth model firearm. But that is not the case and the reason I do not do Range Days any more.

Could have fooled me. I've sat in on 3 classes in the past 5 years and every one of them required shooting to pass the class. You didn't have to shoot accurately, but you did have to shoot. Furthermore, what is the purpose of having online students attend a range day if not for requiring them to shoot?

It's called Feild Reveiw Day.
Required to keep folks honest. Someone could take the on line coarse for you. But when you show up to the reviw day. The student must pass another 10-15 question test. Demonstrate handling and is encouraged to shoot. But they cannot be forced to pull the trigger as a requirement.

I do not support or conduct the on line coarse or reveiws.

[Special T]

I thought id toss this out. its something a guy i know who used to teach Hunt Ed tossed around... Most state certification is now farmed out. Drivers Ed, CDL, Boaters Lic etc. What about allowing For profit or Non profits charge a fee that encourages instructors... And or encourages/allows more thorough investigation to methods and ethics involved in different kinds of hunting. Classes could be held in sporting good stores in the evening or at designated instructional facilities.

[stevemiller]

Slowly take the kids out of hunting This time 14 next time 18 pretty soon it wont even be in the minds of the next generation,Is this what you are after BT?I dont think it is but with the ideas you have brought to our attention in the last 6 months is starting to make me think so.Then you defend them without any thought about future problems with it.  The absolute best Idea that the antis came up with was to start with the kids (in schools even)by changing their ideals.Dont eat meat,you chose your friends not your parents,Everyones a winner, etc, etc, etc. Also this is Washington not other states,we dont need to be in line with other states now do we.Everytime you bring one of these discussions up you try to convince us all that its a good idea because other states are doing it,,,,,,,,,,,,,,SO WHAT.This can be added to several of the threads you started like the Orange spray paint for trespassing signs.OTHER STATES DO IT.   so what.I along with a lot of others wish the other side of the Cascades was another state as well.

[bigtex]

Slowly take the kids out of hunting This time 14 next time 18 pretty soon it wont even be in the minds of the next generation,Is this what you are after BT?I dont think it is but with the ideas you have brought to our attention in the last 6 months is starting to make me think so.Then you defend them without any thought about future problems with it.  The absolute best Idea that the antis came up with was to start with the kids (in schools even)by changing their ideals.Dont eat meat,you chose your friends not your parents,Everyones a winner, etc, etc, etc. Also this is Washington not other states,we dont need to be in line with other states now do we.Everytime you bring one of these discussions up you try to convince us all that its a good idea because other states are doing it,,,,,,,,,,,,,,SO WHAT.This can be added to several of the threads you started like the Orange spray paint for trespassing signs.OTHER STATES DO IT.   so what.I along with a lot of others wish the other side of the Cascades was another state as well.

Please read my posts.  I am not the one who is in the legislature starting these bills. I am opposed to the orange spray pain. I have already said that I think 8 should be the minimum age to attend hunter's ed and that's the only really thing I commented on this bill.

If I wasn't posting these bills who else would be???

But sorry, apparently if I post a bill I am suddenly the author 

[fireweed]

FYI--every bill on the state legislature website has a "comment on this bill" button.  Go to the state legislature website, search with the bill number, and the info. page comes up with a very small green comment button.  Then  concerns get read by the right people (supposedly).

[stevemiller]

No problem with you putting these up here BT,Never thought you were the author,I have read your posts on the issues dont recall you ever giving reasons for not liking them only reasons to defend such bills IE other states do it.I remember you saying you didnt agree with the orange paint but recall you giving several defenses to it and also using the other states have it card.You are intitled to your op. no problem.I dont think there is reasoning for having a min. age here in WA. you think we should because other states do.

[bigtex]

No problem with you putting these up here BT,Never thought you were the author,I have read your posts on the issues dont recall you ever giving reasons for not liking them only reasons to defend such bills IE other states do it.I remember you saying you didnt agree with the orange paint but recall you giving several defenses to it and also using the other states have it card.You are intitled to your op. no problem.I dont think there is reasoning for having a min. age here in WA. you think we should because other states do.

Please read my posts because you are putting words in my mouth

1- I never said we should have a minimum age to hunt because others do. I did say other states do have minimum ages to hunt or hunt alone, but I never said we should follow those states. I said the minimum age for hunter's ed should be 8 because the failure rate below that age is high.
2- I never said other states have the orange paint law for trespassing. In fact, it was other memberswho said that. I also said I was in opposition to this bill.

But once again apparently you are seeing things in my posts that others do not.

[stevemiller]

No you said we should have a min. age of 8.Then you show 2-3 sights that show the other states that do same thing in my eyes thats the same as saying why it should pass.Its what ever BT you defend these bills even when you say you dont agree with them and that is fine you have your Op. I have mine as well,I think you use this forum to see what arguements you might get so you are more prepared to argue them when you need to.You may say you are for or against any of the bills you bring up on here but are you? 

[bigtex]

You may say you are for or against any of the bills you bring up on here but are you? 

Fine Steve. I guess from now on I will only bring up bills that I support. I won't bring up bills that eliminate hunting/fishing rights because I don't support those and I guess I don't want others to get word of those bills.  I guess its better for me to remain silent while we lose our rights then get others angry so they contact their legislators to prevent the eroding of those rights.

It's amazing to me how every couple days I get a message from a member on here thanking me for bringing these issues to light yet you are the only one who sees negative things in them.

[stevemiller]

The only one,Wow that makes me feel warm and fuzzy all over.I just like everyone else is glad someone brings these up,your not the only one but its nice.You are the only one that brings them up and defends the heck out of them argueing with everyone elses op..If you dont want the opinion of others dont give yours.