HB 1563 Would Create a Commercial Fishing Vessel Crewmember License

[Skillet]

With mainstem CR gillnetting becoming a thing of the past, you'd think they would be scrambling to save the two fisheries that they have left in Grays and Willipa.  Any idea what the numbers are in terms of #'s those two commercial fisheries produce annually?

[WSU]

With mainstem CR gillnetting becoming a thing of the past, you'd think they would be scrambling to save the two fisheries that they have left in Grays and Willipa.  Any idea what the numbers are in terms of #'s those two commercial fisheries produce annually?

What kind of numbers do you want to know?  I will post them up.

[Skillet]

Thanks - curious what the pounds of fish the gillnetters are catching out of Willipa and Grays?  Only curious to see if it is enough that they could tax themselves to keep the hatcheries close to self-sustaining.  If they're only bringing in 100,000# of fish, it wouldn't make sense.  But if they're bringing in 5,000,000# of fish they could probably tax themselves $.10/# to pay for them.  I know if I was a Willipa/Grays gillnetter, I'd be all about paying for the operating costs of those hatcheries if I could swing it.  The likelihood of ever getting a hatchery returned to service, or even new hatchery started up after one has been shut down now is next to nil, IMHO.

[WSU]

Here are the landings for the two fisheries: http://wdfw.wa.gov/fishing/commercial/salmon/landings.html

If you look at years past, you can see that the landings vary greatly.  For example, the netters kept roughly 77K coho last year in Willapa.  The year before, they kept roughly 11.5K.  The fisheries are constrained by a number of stocks that have been fished to the point of never making escaping.  Typically that includes wild kings, which never make escapement do to commercial harvest pressure, and chums which have been overharvested as well.  Usually there are enough coho to go around.  The problem is a gillnet can't tell the difference between a chum, king, or coho and nets don't harvest selectively.

Also, before someone jumps on the tribes, please understand that there is no tribal fishery in Willapa.

[Skillet]

Ok, I see where you're coming from now.  Not looking very viable for the gillnetters, especially in Willipa bay.  Even with last year's 94,622 fish, they couldn't tax themselves enough to pay for the just Willipa hatchery and still be able to sell the fish competitively, I'd guess.  Completely speculative, if the Willipa hatchery was half of the $500K costs for the two, even at $250K they'd have to tax themselves about $2.50 a fish if all years averaged as good as this year.  Let's say average 10# silver, that's $.25 /# in a good year.  In last year's 25K fish year (11.5K coho, 13K king), that would be a buck a pound tax.  Not going to happen, and the hatcheries are at risk.  That's too bad, too, since I am certain that a lot of sport fisherman and charterboat guys in Westport depend on that production to keep the economy flowing as the fish are still feeding heavily outside of the bay before they head in.

WDFW may be under some other pressure to continue to operate the Grays Harbor hatcheries for the benefit of the tribal harvest though. That would have Billy Frank's fingerprints all over it, I'm sure.

[BOWHUNTER45]

Do you think this type of greed will ever stop ..it seems they are searching everyway possible to gain revenue ...it is so sad !  We just keep letting do so 

[BOWHUNTER45]

Next it will be people like a carpenters helper or plumbers helper and on and on 

[WSU]

Grays Harbor is a tougher problem due to the tribes.  The other thing to note for Willapa (and GH) is those fish are split 60 or 70 ways (gillnetters).  Nobody is really making a living fishing for a few weeks in the fall.  During the public process to redo the plans for GH and Willapa in the last year or so, gillnetters have argued that they can't fish in certain parts of Willapa Bay because they can't afford the gas to drive their boats across the bay.  They can't afford nets that are more fish friendly.  If you can't afford the gas to drive 5 or 10 miles, is it really a profession we should be bankrupting WDFW to pay for?  WDFW admittedly can't afford to pay for the staff and enforcement officers to operate the fishery.  At best it's a hobby and tax write off. 

[Skillet]

WDFW, and in my opinion all government agencies for that matter, suffer from a non-free-market economic mentality.  They have to spend what they get in terms of funding, or they don't get it again.  In good times (ie., high tax revenue years), they have absolutely no incentive to focus on cutting costs and let them balloon out of control.  Is some cases, they look for ways to make them balloon (I have an incredible story about a waterfront trail currently being put in along the beach in Anacortes to illustrate this one, it is ridiculous).  So when the funding sources tied to non-directly-related activities (like general fund money) are shut down, they panic and say their costs are too high - they need to raise revenues through user fees to pay for things that they never should have been paying for to begin with.  WSU has made a strong argument that the hatcheries in Willipa and Grays fall under this category.

As a lifetime private industry guy that has weathered two economic downturns now, I firmly subscribe to the belief that we must use the good times to prepare for the bad times, and to never waste a good recession.  When I share this point of view with my cohorts in government positions, they either give me a quizzical look or treat me as an unenlightened neanderthal who simply doesn't understand the greater good "the system" provides.  I have tired of that discussion with them...

Ok, off my soapbox for now.

[WSU]

WDFW, and in my opinion all government agencies for that matter, suffer from a non-free-market economic mentality.  They have to spend what they get in terms of funding, or they don't get it again.  In good times (ie., high tax revenue years), they have absolutely no incentive to focus on cutting costs and let them balloon out of control.  Is some cases, they look for ways to make them balloon (I have an incredible story about a waterfront trail currently being put in along the beach in Anacortes to illustrate this one, it is ridiculous).  So when the funding sources tied to non-directly-related activities (like general fund money) are shut down, they panic and say their costs are too high - they need to raise revenues through user fees to pay for things that they never should have been paying for to begin with.  WSU has made a strong argument that the hatcheries in Willipa and Grays fall under this category.

As a lifetime private industry guy that has weathered two economic downturns now, I firmly subscribe to the belief that we must use the good times to prepare for the bad times, and to never waste a good recession.  When I share this point of view with my cohorts in government positions, they either give me a quizzical look or treat me as an unenlightened neanderthal who simply doesn't understand the greater good "the system" provides.  I have tired of that discussion with them...

Ok, off my soapbox for now.

We are in agreement.  However, there is yet another wrinkle here.  As you can see from this bill, a lot of this is pushed by the legislature itself.  I've been following the process.  When WDFW has threatened these hatcheries and commercial fisheries, Blake is on WDFW immediately.  In one instance, a meeting occurred the gillnetters didn't like and he was having a breakfast meeting with Anderson about the meeting just days later.  The legislature, and specifically Blake and a few others, are just as big a part of the problem.

[Firedogg]

 It puts Washington more in line with the rest of the west coast fisheries rules. I would guess it would include more than just salmon fisheries to include crabbing, clam harvesting, and other such commercial harvesting activities. $100 is a drop in the bucket fee to be required to work commercially.

[csaaphill]

Why is this a issue? Why should a crewmember be punsihed for working on a commercial boat?
What areas of abuse is this trying ot adress now? That crewmembers get to work or ? Isn't Washington a right to work state?  but seems to cut the nose off just to spite the face kind of thing to me. BTW I voted no!

[Forks]

I just shelled out a grand to the state for my professional license. If you don't want to pay, find a new career.

[csaaphill]

I just shelled out a grand to the state for my professional license. If you don't want to pay, find a new career.

I take it your for this?

[Forks]

Your guess is correct.