Proposed Grouse Limit Changes

[Curly]

I could see being out hunting for blues and get a 3 bird limit, then on the way back home or to camp be driving along and see a ruffed grouse sitting along side the road. It would be nice to get out and drop that bird too.  Sure isn't difficult to tell the difference between ruffed and blues/dusky. 

Lets say I take trip over to NE Washington to hunt grouse for a weekend since there are a lot of grouse in that part of the state.  Well, that is a long drive and it sure would be nice to be able to have the chance at 4 birds instead of 3 if the biologists are suggesting it.  Yeah, it's harder to get a mixed bag sometimes than all the same kind, but so what.  It's not much different than duck hunting rules where you can get a total of 7 ducks but only some of the total bag limit can be made up of certain species and/or sex.

 I just don't get the idea of arguing for less opportunity if the biologists are suggesting more opportunity.  I don't get the problem here.

[bigtex]

I just don't get the idea of arguing for less opportunity if the biologists are suggesting more opportunity.  I don't get the problem here.

Biologists aren't suggesting more opportunity, they are saying populations are declining! When Douvia pushed for the increase to 4 several years ago there wasn't much science behind it. Now we are facing the consequences.

[MtnMuley]

The proposed change is ridiculous as pointed out above.  Grouse seemed to rebound with a mild winter (not that's the major factor) here in the NC part of the state.  I'd still vote on a 3 bird limit here.   I'd like to know this  Gary Douvia's resoning and logic behind his push...

[Curly]

I just don't get the idea of arguing for less opportunity if the biologists are suggesting more opportunity.  I don't get the problem here.

Biologists aren't suggesting more opportunity, they are saying populations are declining! When Douvia pushed for the increase to 4 several years ago there wasn't much science behind it. Now we are facing the consequences.

So, who is supporting the 3+1 bird limit then.  I would assume biologists are supporting the idea?  3 bird limit vs. 3+1 limit is a reduction in opportunity ........not as bad as 3 bird vs. straight 4 bird limit, but still a reduction. 

It sounded like you were suggesting a 3 bird limit, so that is less opportunity than the proposed 3+1 bird limit.

[bobcat]

I don't believe harvest by hunters has much effect overall on grouse numbers. A reduction  of the daily limit from 4 to 3 would not have any significant effect, in my opinion. The bigger factors are weather, habitat, and predators. The best thing that could be done to bring grouse populations back up is a ban on herbicide use.

[Jonathan_S]

I don't believe harvest by hunters has much effect overall on grouse numbers. A reduction  of the daily limit from 4 to 3 would not have any significant effect, in my opinion. The bigger factors are weather, habitat, and predators. The best thing that could be done to bring grouse populations back up is a ban on herbicide use.

  A grouse population can be almost double from one year to the next and weather is the single biggest factor in that.  Over time we've seen declines from predators that aren't reduced at all from methods such as effective trapping and hound hunting.

I second the herbicide comment

[RadSav]

I never realized it changed from a 3/day limit.   So I get to shoot one more!

Seriously though, I think it opens the door for kids and less educated good honest folk to get into trouble.

Yep, this kind of smells like a revenue generator that will result in some wasted game to me.  Kind of like the true spike rule...

Revenue generator for who? WDFW doesn't get $ from tickets they write and this offense isn't a ticketable offense.

What kind of offense is it?  Don't you get a ticket for too many birds in a bag?  Never been ticketed before so I'm just curious.

[Man Tracker]

Offense would be charged as a misdemeanor for exceeding the bag limit.  (if you harvest 4 of the same species or more than 4)  Providing the officer can tell one from another!

[HUNTINCOUPLE]

Maybe the Wolf has caused the decline in grouse numbers?

[Buck Rub Jr]

I don't see the big deal, usually when I go for grouse if I see 4+ grouse it's not all the same species. But that's just the areas I go. Shoot your three blues or ruffs...if you don't get a fourth then oh well..?

[bigtex]

I never realized it changed from a 3/day limit.   So I get to shoot one more!

Seriously though, I think it opens the door for kids and less educated good honest folk to get into trouble.

Yep, this kind of smells like a revenue generator that will result in some wasted game to me.  Kind of like the true spike rule...

Revenue generator for who? WDFW doesn't get $ from tickets they write and this offense isn't a ticketable offense.

What kind of offense is it?  Don't you get a ticket for too many birds in a bag?  Never been ticketed before so I'm just curious.

Like Man Tracker said it's a misdemeanor. Officers can no longer issue misdemeanor and gross misdemeanor tickets with a fine. All misdemeanors and gross misdemeanors must now go before a judge.

[trophyhunt]

Limit should only be 3, I hardly see grouse any more while in the woods.  If herbicides are a big reason then they need to be banned, are causes even talked about at the wdfw?  If so, are solutions talked about?  Not trying to be an ass, really just wondering.

[bobcat]

Limit should only be 3, I hardly see grouse any more while in the woods.  If herbicides are a big reason then they need to be banned, are causes even talked about at the wdfw?  If so, are solutions talked about?  Not trying to be an ass, really just wondering.

If you hardly see any what's the difference if the limit is 3 or 4? If that's the case a guy would be lucky to get just one. Maybe we need to have a tag for grouse just like turkeys. One per year.   

The last good grouse year in SW Washington in my experience was 2009. I got a couple of 4 bird limits that year. Since then I think I've only killed one grouse each year. But I didn't hunt them either, since I wasn't seeing lots of them like I did in 2009. And that's the thing, when populations are low, hunting pressure is low as well.

That's why I don't think a change in the limit will make any difference. The limit could be 10 per day and l don't think it would have any affect on overall numbers. What we really need is a dry, warm spring. A ban on herbicides would be great as well, but we all know that will never happen.

[MtnMuley]

Wasn't the limit only 3 back in 09???

[boneaddict]

Move it back to three.   Keep it simple.