Reloading

[meathunter]

Wondering what all the experts on here do when starting load development. what is your method of madness? do you start with trying to tune the powder first and then play around with c.o.a.l. ?  or perhaps the other way around?

Just looking to pick brains on this and I apologize if this topic has been covered already.

-MEAT

[tonymiller7]

I start with the most accurate load tested per the book for each powder and then go from there based on accuracy and desired velocities.

[Taco280AI]

I'm still a newb, but I'll load some up 3 at a time .5 up to .5 over max looking at accuracy and any pressure signs. Take the most accurate of those then start playing with seating depth.

[sumpnz]

I usually start by doing 3 different powder loads in however many powders I want to consider (usually at least 2, sometimes 3) when working up a whole new load.  At least 5 rounds at each powder/weight combo.  I chronograph those loads and select based on lowest standard deviation of velocity, followed by highest average velocity if two are really close.  Then take that powder/weight and go 1 grain above and below to see if accuracy (this time looking at group sizes) is better by going up or down.  You can then further refine powder charge by going in half grain increments above and below you best, and iterate until you find the best accuracy.  Then I'd start playing with seating depth.  For that, start off seating as far out as you can.  That may be limited by the throat of the gun (usual minimum is 0.010" off the lands), or magazine length (don't want bullets causing jamming in the magazine), or especially with light for caliber bullets the engagement in the neck of the brass (you want the bullet to at least make it the transition from neck to shoulder).  From that longest OAL you can then run the seating depth down in, say, 0.005" increments until groups start to open up. 

Of course, you can then start iterating on powder charges again depending on how much time and money you want to spend on the development process.

Usually I just call it good once I'm down to 1" at 100 yards.  That usually occurs without even messing around with OAL (I usually seat as far out as I can - in my 6.5x55mm that is limited by the throat and in my 9.3x62mm that is limited by the magazine).  Often, I get best accuracy from near book max loads, so if I try to tune at all I'm only going half a grain over anyway.

[meathunter]

So my set up is Cooper chambered in 26 Nosler topped with a Leupold VX-6 3-18x50mm (30mm tube).  I've worked up at least 30-40 different loads in 4 shot groups and have yet to even come close to the 1/2" groups @ 100yds that Cooper claims. Groups are closer 1-5"- 3" @ 100 yds.

I've been working out of the Nosler book for loads and I've also emailed Berger and got there load data for the 26.

With out going thru all the bullets and loads I've tried, I just haven't had this much of an issue dialing in a load before and naturally it's crunch time 

Just want to make sure I'm not missing something

[meathunter]

Obviously I could be having a copper issue I guess. I did break the barrel in per Cooper instructions. would any of you guys recommend lapping the barrel?

[sumpnz]

Don't know about lapping, but if you can find "Wipe Out" it works really well.  It's a foaming bore cleaner and is excellent for removing copper fouling (along with powder residue and even lead fouling).  If you're getting excessive copper fouling then lapping would be worth trying.

If your groups are still bad after cleaning out the copper then get some factory ammo and see how it does.  Also, obviously, check that everything is tight for scope mounts/rings, action screws, etc.

[Ice Cap]

Look up how to do a load development ladder test

[CaNINE]

I start with a recommended starting load using a H-series extreme powder.  I then load up 3 - 4 different seating depths (ex. .010, 0.050, 0.090) all using the same starting charge weight.  I test these to see which performs best for precision and ES.  There is always a clear winner.  I then load up a ladder test using the best seating depth and starting with the initial load work my way up in 1% increments using one-shot groups fired at the same point of aim.  I look for what range of charge weights group the closest together.  For example I might see that 88, 88.8 and 89. 6 form a cluster with low vertical dispersion.  So I pick 88.8 grains and load up 10 shots to see if it performs.  My standard is half MOA and less than 20 ES.  If it meets that standard then I reconfirm over different ambient conditions and distances to determine how the load performs and behaves.  I may tweak seating depth at this point to fine tune the load, which may deliver .25 MOA but this level of precision is not really required for hunting and I can't reliably shoot that good anyhow.     

[CP]

I start .050 off the lands using this technique:

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2012/07/tool-tip-make-your-own-length-to-lands-gauge/

[Curly]

Meat, since this topic is in the classifieds, are you wanting to sell that cooper?

Sounds like you could shoot out that barrel before finding a load. 

Sounds like you are doing it right. Nosler data should be good. They list the most accurate powder tested and the most accurate load. That is where I would start, which sounds like you did.

If you go to the berger website, they have a procedure listed for finding the most accurate load. I'd go with that procedure for adjusting seating depth whether using bergers or another bullet.

[slm9s]

First, make sure its the loads and not something like a loose scope base, loose ring, or bad scope.  (It happens)

[meathunter]

Meat, since this topic is in the classifieds, are you wanting to sell that cooper?

Sounds like you could shoot out that barrel before finding a load. 

Sounds like you are doing it right. Nosler data should be good. They list the most accurate powder tested and the most accurate load. That is where I would start, which sounds like you did.

If you go to the berger website, they have a procedure listed for finding the most accurate load. I'd go with that procedure for adjusting seating depth whether using bergers or another bullet.

My bad... didn't see the "Guns and Ammo" below feel free to move this topic, and yeah that thought has crossed my mind about shooting out the barrel. I think I have close to 200 rds thru it and still haven't found a group yet. You guys have a lot of info here . looks like I have some reading to do.

[T Pearce]

Verify all is tight... scrub copper deposits from bore. Try again with barrel and bullet mfg loads.
Ive had the fast movers fall apart on paper only to find I should have cleaned.
T

[bobcat]

This is the procedure recommended by Berger that Curly was referring to:

Solution

The following has been verified by numerous shooters in many rifles using bullets of different calibers and weights. It is consistent for all VLD bullets. What has been discovered is that VLD bullets shoot best when loaded to a COAL that puts the bullet in a “sweet spot”. This sweet spot is a band .030 to .040 wide and is located anywhere between jamming the bullets into the lands and .150 jump off the lands.

Note: When discussing jam and jump I am referring to the distance from the area of the bearing surface that engages the rifling and the rifling itself. There are many products that allow you to measure these critical dimensions. Some are better than others. I won’t be going into the methods of measuring jam and jump. If you are not familiar with this aspect of reloading it is critically important that you understand this concept before you attempt this test.

Many reloaders feel (and I tend to agree) that meaningful COAL adjustments are .002 to .005. Every once in a while I might adjust the COAL by .010 but this seems like I am moving the bullet the length of a football field. The only way a shooter will be able to benefit from this situation is to let go of this opinion that more than .010 change is too much (me included).

Trying to find the COAL that puts you in the sweet spot by moving .002 to .010 will take so long the barrel may be worn out by the time you sort it out if you don’t give up first. Since the sweet spot is .030 to .040 wide we recommend that you conduct the following test to find your rifles VLD sweet spot.

Load 24 rounds at the following COAL if you are a target competition shooter who does not worry about jamming a bullet:

    .010 into (touching) the lands (jam) 6 rounds
    .040 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
    .080 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
    .120 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds

Load 24 rounds at the following COAL if you are a hunter (pulling a bullet out of the case with your rifling while in the field can be a hunt ending event which must be avoided) or a competition shooter who worries about pulling a bullet during a match:

    .010 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
    .050 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
    .090 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds
    .130 off the lands (jump) 6 rounds

Shoot 2 (separate) 3 shot groups in fair conditions to see how they group. The remarkable reality of this test is that one of these 4 COALs will outperform the other three by a considerable margin. Once you know which one of these 4 COAL shoots best then you can tweak the COAL +/- .002 or .005. Taking the time to set this test up will pay off when you find that your rifle is capable of shooting the VLD bullets very well (even at 100 yards).

Regards,
Eric Stecker
Master Bulletsmith

http://www.bergerbullets.com/vld-making-shoot/