Is 3 pt RULE HURTING MULE DEER POPULATIONS?

[Katmai Guy]

Really want to help the mule deer herd?  Stop hunting them for 5 yrs completely and permit for 3pt and up after that.

[Katmai Guy]

But nobody will because they want the chance to shoot the biggest buck that they can every year.  Sounds kind of selfish now doesn't it?

[Jonathan_S]

I chuckle at how many people say they see huge two points.

In what respect?

I guess in short, I don't believe most of them. It's just a cool thing to say I guess.

[jackelope]

I chuckle at how many people say they see huge two points.

In what respect?

I guess in short, I don't believe most of them. It's just a cool thing to say I guess.

As was mentioned earlier I think...one person's idea of a "huge" 2 point is different than the next person's.

[WAcoyotehunter]

Why isn't anyone talking about habitat issues to help the deer populations?  It's not an accident that the deer herd was at it's all time (in written record) high ~30-50 years after a HUGE fire year and while logging across the west was going crazy. 

If we want more deer we should be talking about habitat issues: weeds are a terrible issue, the winter range is largely developed with homes and roads, logging is slow, and fires are still being repressed.  Couple those habitat issues with loss to roadkill, increased predation and poaching and it should not be a surprise that legal hunters are disappointed. 

[bigmacc]

Move the season later? Are you serious?
2x1 equals a three point.   Oh my! 

The reason you guys see two points is its all that is left.  I guarantee if it wasn't 3 point or better, you wouldn't see them either. Lol.

Two points aren't the destruction of the herd.  Most of those two points will be nice bucks if you let them live more than two years.  Yes, there are an occasional big one.  There always has been.  It's interesting that all of you are worried about messing with the genetic gene pool.   Shooting the upper crust with rut tags every year will probably do more damage to the herd, lol. 

Hunting is going to have to be limited.  I hate to see it, but I do more hunting with a camera these days anyways.   It does play right into the wolfhuggers though.  What is hunting but a way to cull off the extras and manage a population.   Well, we are in a hole right now in the methow.    I guess you can focus on the Entitat.  It hasn't been destroyed YET

 

[swanny]

I wont deny that i see a ton  of mulie two points all across the state. But I honestly think sticking with a 3pt minimum is still the best way to go. Really what I feel i'm hearing when people talk about two many 2pts is that their hunt was unsuccessful and they feel that they should be shooting not hunting. If you want gauanteed meet in your freezer, put in for a doe tag. If you want a buck, be patient and work to find the 3pt.

[dmoua]

I chuckle at how many people say they see huge two points.

In what respect?

I guess in short, I don't believe most of them. It's just a cool thing to say I guess.

[Mr Mykiss]

Are you calling that deer huge?

[JBar]

Are you calling that deer huge?

He may not be mature but he's not your average 2pt either.

[RileyH]

Not meaning to offend anyone with this but...

I think the problem is more the laziness of the average hunter, and unwillingness to work for a mature deer. Same basic philosophical issue everyone loves to point out about my fellow millennials, everyone feels they deserve "it" (self-defined) and it's all Red Herring's and finger pointing when they don't get "it" because it sure isn't their fault.

Deer aren't dumb like the average hunter I've spoken to seems to think. Opening day when the swarms of road hunters take to the Methow Valley, the mature deer move up and away from the roads like clockwork. The big bucks know what time of the year it is, this happens on a schedule and there aren't 40 trucks on the road when it's not hunting season. I saw six (6) nice 4x's opening weekend, including a 170's buck that I missed, all moving up the hills directly away from the roads. It was maybe an hour after light and they were already well on their way to their hiding spots. Saw about 20 trophy class trucks cruising circles as well through the spotting scope, loaded up with guys and guns. My Dad said the number of road warriors the last two years reminds him of the 70's and 80's.

Only the young bucks are left hanging around because they don't know any better. Which leads to desperate (see lazy) hunters growing 3rds like magic and smoking all the spikes and 2's along the roads. I watched a truck through the scope this year get out and shoot two guns at a group of deer along the road, walk up to where they were standing, hustle back to the truck and leave. Went to look on my way back to camp that night and there was a dead 2x lying 50' off the road with the backstraps cut out. Hell I was packing my buck out and about a half mile from the road and two guys drove up on me in a four-wheeler, beers in hand, asking how I managed to find a buck with "no deer around".

I've seen some of these super 2s running around as well, but only down in Steptoe and Ritzville. They are truly 4-7 year old bucks in their prime with massive frames, I saw one this year this had to be 24" tall and 28"+ wide, just outside of Sprague.

A seemingly large increase in the number of hunters, the average guy being too lazy and/or unethical, and the natural cycle and evolution are all that's happening in my opinion. Now when the wolves start to spread like wildfire, then we'll have a serious issue to talk about. 

[pianoman9701]

Why isn't anyone talking about habitat issues to help the deer populations?  It's not an accident that the deer herd was at it's all time (in written record) high ~30-50 years after a HUGE fire year and while logging across the west was going crazy. 

If we want more deer we should be talking about habitat issues: weeds are a terrible issue, the winter range is largely developed with homes and roads, logging is slow, and fires are still being repressed.  Couple those habitat issues with loss to roadkill, increased predation and poaching and it should not be a surprise that legal hunters are disappointed.

A lot of people are talking about and working on habitat issues. The solutions are not mutually exclusive.

[Mr Mykiss]

Are you calling that deer huge?

He may not be mature but he's not your average 2pt either.

My bad...I forgot there for a minute that we were talking about WA mule deer. Yep that there is a huge mule deer (in WA) the kinda deer that you bring back to camp and people be all like "Daaaaaaaaang son. Where'd you find that one??"

[buckfvr]

Sure habitat  is a major issue........people now occupy most all historical mule deer wintering grounds.  This state may be the worst. 

[Curly]

Seeing how mature mule deer bucks are the best for breeding does, maybe no rut permit hunts should occur in some of these areas where numbers are way down.  That might help keep some of the big boys around to spread their genes and have the most success in breeding and fawn survival.  Maybe no doe seasons should occur until the deer numbers go up?   

It all depends on what hunters are willing to live with and what WDFW is willing to lose on license revenue.  I suspect the majority of hunters aren't willing to make changes and WDFW doesn't want to lose license revenue.