Wdfw drawing fiasco explanation

[trophyhunt]

I just talked with a lady at wdfw who is part of the team that does the draws.  I've been a witness at a couple of these events and being there gives you a better idea of what goes on.  Unfortunately not everyone will get a chance at being a witness, so I will pass on what she told me about this years draw.  There were approx. 250,000 applicants this year, approx. 248,000 put in for hunts and the others points only.  Each persons apps are checked to make sure everything is valid on the app and they are eligible to apply for that tag. That is what takes most the time before we get to the actual draw.  When all the applicants are gone through, the numbers of your points are squared and your random draw numbers are assigned by the computer.  So when the witness shows up, the draw is pretty much done.  We witness them "pushing the button", then the tags are assigned to the ones with the lowest numbers.  Now the system needs to update the accounts of those drawn, "the backdoor", it updates the Active Licenses, Order History and Hunter report tabs, then it sends an email to the ones who put in for that species (points only people don't get an email). One species at a time is drawn, yesterday elk was first, and at 530 AM some results went out.  She said at that moment the system got slammed be people looking, so much so that she had to pull the tabs for points and special hunts to try and finish the rest of the draws, around 24 of them.  She said their server just can't take that volume of hits it was receiving, Amazons servers can but the wdfw server can't.  That is why it took all day to get results out, the system was taking all the hits from people searching for results, she was running all the other species draws, other vendors are still doing their business all over the state, people buying product, licenses ext.  One of the issues was we all knew when the results were to be posted, I told her the email they sent out telling us when the results would be out was a mistake, it was for good intentions but it focused everyone on that date.  Next year there will only be one email sent out to those who put in for permits and it will probably be sent after all the draws are done and not one at a time.  I hope Jason Phelps can give his impression since he was just there.  And they do watch Huntwa through this entire drawing process, they really want us to understand what goes on so we are not so frustrated.  I hope this helps

[rtspring]

They just need to lock the site down until all the results are up.  That was a total disaster yesterday.  And I demand a redraw ha ha

[JimmyHoffa]

It isn't new that lots and lots of hunters are waiting and constantly checking the site this time of year.

[Mfowl]

So they really do wait until there is 50 or more pages in the Special Permit Results thread before running the draw?!

[bobcat]

Just one email after the draw is completely finished and results are available would be great. No need for an email each time a category is completed. I think part of the problem has to do with the ridiculous number of "categories." No other state has this kind of a system in which there are several different categories for each species. I think they said there are 28 categories altogether, that's for five animals- deer, elk, goat, sheep, and moose. That's just crazy. But it is what it is. Dave Ware created this mess and now he's retired and doesn't care! With as long as it takes to do the draw, I think they should just do what Wyoming does. Give a specific date and time when results will be ready. Nobody can check until that time. It works great for Wyoming.

[lamrith]

Thanks for the insight Jerry.  I think it is probably your fault it was a mess anyway..

It isn't new that lots and lots of hunters are waiting and constantly checking the site this time of year.

True, but as Jerry mentions, their email and message telling everyone "exactly" when the draw was happening and would be posted was a mistake.  Well intentioned but it in itself caused a severe overload.  Pretty much backfired on them.

My recommendation to them for next time is not to send the email.  Just do the draw take the tabs down, post the results, then put the tabs back up once everything is done.  Probably be worth getting in touch with states like WY, AZ, etc that have MUCH larger hunter app numbers and how they do it, since those states seem to go off without a hitch every year.

[LongBomb]

Why not lock out the site for the day. Yeah the system might crash as soon as it comes back online but then its on us and we cant blame WDFW, we can blame the other 247,999 ppl that are rude enough to try checking and hindering "my" draw results.

[Karl Blanchard]

I said it countless times yesterday, the "fiasco" yesterday was the hysteria of grown men that can't just keep their composure until OFFICIAL DRAW RESULTS WERE ACTUALLY POSTED!!  The draw was not screwed up yesterday it ran just fine we just couldn't be patient adults and wait until results were actually up. Yes I think the email after every category was kind of stupid but that doesn't negate the fact that we couldn't just wait until they were out.

They said the 21st and they were out the 21st.  If people weren't frantically trying to check every three seconds they would have been out in the a.m. as well.  I hope next year they lock it down until it's all done.  Send an email out the day after.

[WildlifeAssassin]

There are simple solutions to those problems, several mentioned already. Set it up so it locks the site down from 1am-4am and update everything then. It's computer code, you control exactly what happens. Be adults, we don't want to hear about your problems, we want to see solutions. JESUS!

[bigtex]

I said it countless times yesterday, the "fiasco" yesterday was the hysteria of grown men that can't just keep their composure until OFFICIAL DRAW RESULTS WERE ACTUALLY POSTED!!  The draw was not screwed up yesterday it ran just fine we just couldn't be patient adults and wait until results were actually up. Yes I think the email after every category was kind of stupid but that doesn't negate the fact that we couldn't just wait until they were out.

They said the 21st and they were out the 21st.  If people weren't frantically trying to check every three seconds they would have been out in the a.m. as well.  I hope next year they lock it down until it's all done.  Send an email out the day after.

 

[bobcat]

I don't think it was a fiasco either. It just took much longer than expected. The problem nowadays is everyone is online 24/7.

In the past everyone would be working during the day and would be unable to check until they got home in the evening.

The biggest issue was them telling us results would be available EARLY. It was 4:40 PM. That's not early.

[Curly]

I just have to wonder if WDFW had not spent so much $ (I think it was over $800,000) on that lady that is supposed to get pro-wolf and anti-wolf folks to get along if they would have had the $ for servers that could handle the load?

[Karl Blanchard]

I don't think it was a fiasco either. It just took much longer than expected. The problem nowadays is everyone is online 24/7.

In the past everyone would be working during the day and would be unable to check until they got home in the evening.

The biggest issue was them telling us results would be available EARLY. It was 4:40 PM. That's not early.

  yeah but that was not the fault of WDFW or the draw system.  That was the fault of too much traffic from a bunch of manchildren.  They definitely do need to upgrade servers though.  Get something that can handle the traffic or lock it until it's done. 

[Blacktail Sniper]

It is clearly Al Gore's fault!!  If he had not invented the internet, this would not be a problem!! 

It just seems funny that "we" have all gotten used to instant results and therefore expect it from everything and everyone.  I cannot imagine the pain and angst it would cause today if they went back to the pre-internet days.

Imagine the horror of having to put your application card in the mail and trust the post office to deliver it.  Then have to trust that your card didn't get lost or put in the wrong box while waiting to do the draw.

Then hope and pray that it doesn't get lost or destroyed in a car wreck while being transported to the various regions where they were dumped into a rolling drum and pulled out one at a time by hand...ohhh the agony!!!

Could things be done differently, yup sure could, would it be better...who knows!

Oh, I almost forgot, the part about waiting for them to mail you your permit and hoping all the things you worried about when you sent the application in not happening before it gets back to your mailbox... 

[bornhunter]

What about those of us who didnt get any email at all?