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Author Topic: The real problem with predator control  (Read 6828 times)

Offline konradcountry

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The real problem with predator control
« on: January 02, 2019, 09:26:12 AM »
I see a lot of talk about wanting the state to do something about predator control. . Yea well even if we get the state to change it will take a couple years for any plan to go into action.

Here is what I think is the main problem. How many times have you heard the following from other hunters:
I only hunt deer
I don't like bear meat
I am all for coyote hunting. Please keep killing them for me.
I only hunt what I can eat
They're too fast / can't bow hunt them
I used to hunt coyotes.
I don't like gutting bears.
Bears are too cute/likeable.
Coyote hunting sounds fun. But I'm too busy this year.
I don't want to drive that far for predator hunting
Wife/girlfriend won't let me kill cats/bears
I like cats, couldn't shoot one
Bears/Cougars are too hard without bait/hounds
Someone should do something about the predators

Offline KFhunter

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2019, 10:08:19 AM »
My idea was the Predator Incentive Point System.  PIPS


Shooting various predators would give incentive points to something like a quality buck or elk, the idea is that if a hunter has killed enough predators they've earned that huge buck in a quality unit, during a quality hunt window.  The details could be worked out later, I'd just like to get this idea of PIPS out there floating around.



Offline jackelope

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #2 on: January 03, 2019, 10:11:58 AM »
I don't spend much time predator hunting because I struggle finding time outside of family/work/kid stuff. I tried coyote hunting a couple times around me and it's tough. I've never even seen one while hunting.  Over east in the open country is obviously a different story. I've never been interested in shooting a bear but always have a small game tag and a cougar tag just in case a bobcat or cougar ends up in front of me.

I know....excuses excuses...
:fire.:

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Offline Special T

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2019, 10:26:33 AM »
If they offered a Predator Pagage of Small game, Cougar and Bear Id buy it! They did away with the Deer or Elk combo to raise rev. I would love to look at aggregate sales info for the different time periods around policy changes.
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Offline KFhunter

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #4 on: January 03, 2019, 10:27:17 AM »
I don't spend much time predator hunting because I struggle finding time outside of family/work/kid stuff. I tried coyote hunting a couple times around me and it's tough. I've never even seen one while hunting.  Over east in the open country is obviously a different story. I've never been interested in shooting a bear but always have a small game tag and a cougar tag just in case a bobcat or cougar ends up in front of me.

I know....excuses excuses...

Would predator incentive points help get you out hunting them? 
If you had an opportunity to to get a multi season PIP tag, or quality buck points..would you chase more predators?

Offline KFhunter

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2019, 10:29:25 AM »
If they offered a Predator Pagage of Small game, Cougar and Bear Id buy it! They did away with the Deer or Elk combo to raise rev. I would love to look at aggregate sales info for the different time periods around policy changes.

I think what you mean is a predator combo package?  bear, cougar, *wolf + small game


*if or when that ever comes around

Offline jackelope

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2019, 10:29:32 AM »
I don't spend much time predator hunting because I struggle finding time outside of family/work/kid stuff. I tried coyote hunting a couple times around me and it's tough. I've never even seen one while hunting.  Over east in the open country is obviously a different story. I've never been interested in shooting a bear but always have a small game tag and a cougar tag just in case a bobcat or cougar ends up in front of me.

I know....excuses excuses...

Would predator incentive points help get you out hunting them? 
If you had an opportunity to to get a multi season PIP tag, or quality buck points..would you chase more predators?

Probably not in all honesty. I'm plenty motivated to spend more time in the woods. It's not about lacking motivation at all.
:fire.:

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Offline Special T

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2019, 10:31:37 AM »
I don't spend much time predator hunting because I struggle finding time outside of family/work/kid stuff. I tried coyote hunting a couple times around me and it's tough. I've never even seen one while hunting.  Over east in the open country is obviously a different story. I've never been interested in shooting a bear but always have a small game tag and a cougar tag just in case a bobcat or cougar ends up in front of me.

I know....excuses excuses...

Would predator incentive points help get you out hunting them? 
If you had an opportunity to to get a multi season PIP tag, or quality buck points..would you chase more predators?

I think predator hunting is a timing issue. Most of us only really hunt weekend with the possible weeks elk or deer camp. There is no shortage of cats and look they limit opportunity. there is no shortage of bears, and they reduce or eliminate spring bear hunts. How many folks could have harvested a cougar during turkey season?
In archery we have something like the way of the superior man. When the archer misses the center of the target, he turns round and seeks for the cause of his failure in himself. 

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Offline bobcat

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2019, 10:36:35 AM »
Go to a draw system or some other type of system in which people can only hunt deer and elk every other year, at the most, and I bet people would find they have a lot more time for predator hunting.

Offline idahohuntr

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2019, 10:40:27 AM »
My idea was the Predator Incentive Point System.  PIPS


Shooting various predators would give incentive points to something like a quality buck or elk, the idea is that if a hunter has killed enough predators they've earned that huge buck in a quality unit, during a quality hunt window.  The details could be worked out later, I'd just like to get this idea of PIPS out there floating around.
Bad idea.  The last thing this state needs to do is further complicate and expand it's point system.  If you want to incentive predator harvest - do something like the foundation for wildlife management and raise private funds to incentive or reimburse those who legally harvest predators. 
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - TR

Offline bearpaw

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2019, 10:57:22 AM »
My idea was the Predator Incentive Point System.  PIPS


Shooting various predators would give incentive points to something like a quality buck or elk, the idea is that if a hunter has killed enough predators they've earned that huge buck in a quality unit, during a quality hunt window.  The details could be worked out later, I'd just like to get this idea of PIPS out there floating around.
Bad idea.  The last thing this state needs to do is further complicate and expand it's point system.  If you want to incentive predator harvest - do something like the foundation for wildlife management and raise private funds to incentive or reimburse those who legally harvest predators.

 :yeah:  I agree
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Offline Special T

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2019, 11:14:10 AM »
I say we make it legal to cage trap Cougars.  we never reach quotas here on the the west side,  :twocents:
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Offline Cougartail

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2019, 11:22:56 AM »
I love to predator hunt.. but would rather sit on the internet and BS the troops!
« Last Edit: January 03, 2019, 05:18:18 PM by Cougartail »
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Offline KFhunter

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2019, 04:48:35 PM »
My idea was the Predator Incentive Point System.  PIPS


Shooting various predators would give incentive points to something like a quality buck or elk, the idea is that if a hunter has killed enough predators they've earned that huge buck in a quality unit, during a quality hunt window.  The details could be worked out later, I'd just like to get this idea of PIPS out there floating around.
Bad idea.  The last thing this state needs to do is further complicate and expand it's point system.  If you want to incentive predator harvest - do something like the foundation for wildlife management and raise private funds to incentive or reimburse those who legally harvest predators.

I certainly wouldn't be against F4W version in Washington but I'm not sure how it would work other than possibly coyotes  :dunno: 

We can't usually take more than one species of big game predator except bear on the west side (limit 2) w4m is paying for wolf trappers,  if we ever get to hunt the wolf it won't be more than a special draw or 1 wolf bag limit annually.   

It's not even easy to just get a coyote derby permit here in WA, coyote madness failed this year, if it was easy (or didn't require a permit in the first place) we'd have yote hunters out there trying to knock down some yotes, possibly even giving our antelope a better chance at keeping fawns. WDFW makes it a complicated and lengthy process.  Bearpaw knows more about this than I do.  https://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,233490.0.html


Can anyone imagine WDFW giving a thing like foundation for wildlife management a green light to pay the equivalent of bounties?


I'm all ears, instead of crapping on ideas how about coming up with some  :dunno:

Offline Cougartail

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2019, 05:27:28 PM »
My idea was the Predator Incentive Point System.  PIPS


Shooting various predators would give incentive points to something like a quality buck or elk, the idea is that if a hunter has killed enough predators they've earned that huge buck in a quality unit, during a quality hunt window.  The details could be worked out later, I'd just like to get this idea of PIPS out there floating around.
Bad idea.  The last thing this state needs to do is further complicate and expand it's point system.  If you want to incentive predator harvest - do something like the foundation for wildlife management and raise private funds to incentive or reimburse those who legally harvest predators.

I certainly wouldn't be against F4W version in Washington but I'm not sure how it would work other than possibly coyotes  :dunno: 

We can't usually take more than one species of big game predator except bear on the west side (limit 2) w4m is paying for wolf trappers,  if we ever get to hunt the wolf it won't be more than a special draw or 1 wolf bag limit annually.   

It's not even easy to just get a coyote derby permit here in WA, coyote madness failed this year, if it was easy (or didn't require a permit in the first place) we'd have yote hunters out there trying to knock down some yotes, possibly even giving our antelope a better chance at keeping fawns. WDFW makes it a complicated and lengthy process.  Bearpaw knows more about this than I do.  https://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,233490.0.html


Can anyone imagine WDFW giving a thing like foundation for wildlife management a green light to pay the equivalent of bounties?


I'm all ears, instead of crapping on ideas how about coming up with some  :dunno:


A business that gets its money from donations like gofundme could buy furs year round for $75.00. Totally legal and would be a big boost to predator harvest.
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Offline KFhunter

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #15 on: January 03, 2019, 05:29:19 PM »
Wouldn't they have to get a permit?  like a fur handlers permit?

Maybe if they didn't resale them.



The tribes are buying fish heads, maybe routing this through the tribe somehow would work.  Instead of fish heads it could be coyote tails.

Offline brew

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #16 on: January 03, 2019, 05:31:20 PM »
hounds
beer---it's whats for dinner

Offline hunter399

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #17 on: January 03, 2019, 05:33:04 PM »
Go fund me coyote bounty.
Start a go fund me March 1 ,collect money through the year till December ,january and February are the only months bounty is given.If any money is left March 1 it is used for trace mineral salt blocks scattered all over the state for deer ,elk,moose that are having fawns.


Offline Cougartail

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #18 on: January 03, 2019, 05:42:06 PM »
Wouldn't they have to get a permit?  like a fur handlers permit?

Maybe if they didn't resale them.



The tribes are buying fish heads, maybe routing this through the tribe somehow would work.  Instead of fish heads it could be coyote tails.

If you resell them yes.. Easy to do.  Between donations and revenue from sales I'll bet it would expand quickly.
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Offline Bigshooter

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #19 on: January 03, 2019, 05:59:50 PM »
I see a lot of talk about wanting the state to do something about predator control. . Yea well even if we get the state to change it will take a couple years for any plan to go into action.

Here is what I think is the main problem. How many times have you heard the following from other hunters:
I only hunt deer
I don't like bear meat
I am all for coyote hunting. Please keep killing them for me.
I only hunt what I can eat
They're too fast / can't bow hunt them
I used to hunt coyotes.
I don't like gutting bears.
Bears are too cute/likeable.
Coyote hunting sounds fun. But I'm too busy this year.
I don't want to drive that far for predator hunting
Wife/girlfriend won't let me kill cats/bears
I like cats, couldn't shoot one
Bears/Cougars are too hard without bait/hounds
Someone should do something about the predators

There is only one way to effectively manage predators.  And that is to use tools that we are not allowed to use in WA.  Such as dogs, bait and steel traps.  Without these things there is no such thing as predator control.
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Offline bearpaw

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #20 on: January 06, 2019, 03:45:17 PM »
My idea was the Predator Incentive Point System.  PIPS


Shooting various predators would give incentive points to something like a quality buck or elk, the idea is that if a hunter has killed enough predators they've earned that huge buck in a quality unit, during a quality hunt window.  The details could be worked out later, I'd just like to get this idea of PIPS out there floating around.
Bad idea.  The last thing this state needs to do is further complicate and expand it's point system.  If you want to incentive predator harvest - do something like the foundation for wildlife management and raise private funds to incentive or reimburse those who legally harvest predators.

I certainly wouldn't be against F4W version in Washington but I'm not sure how it would work other than possibly coyotes  :dunno: 

We can't usually take more than one species of big game predator except bear on the west side (limit 2) w4m is paying for wolf trappers,  if we ever get to hunt the wolf it won't be more than a special draw or 1 wolf bag limit annually.   

It's not even easy to just get a coyote derby permit here in WA, coyote madness failed this year, if it was easy (or didn't require a permit in the first place) we'd have yote hunters out there trying to knock down some yotes, possibly even giving our antelope a better chance at keeping fawns. WDFW makes it a complicated and lengthy process.  Bearpaw knows more about this than I do.  https://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,233490.0.html


Can anyone imagine WDFW giving a thing like foundation for wildlife management a green light to pay the equivalent of bounties?


I'm all ears, instead of crapping on ideas how about coming up with some  :dunno:

The key to how F4W works is that they are not paying a bounty, they are paying expense reimbursements for hunters making legal kills. You have to photocopy your receipts of expenses and send them to get reimbursed. Depending on area of kill you can get reimbursed for expenses up to $1000 per wolf. I think that includes reimbursement for trucks, snowmobiles, fuel, traps, guns, etc purchased for hunting wolves. I do think the same thing may be possible for coyotes, bear, and/or cougar in WA, unless there is something in the law preventing reimbursements? A person would have to question WDFW very specifically.

For example on how specific wording makes a difference: We can't hold a hunting contest based on the number of animals killed unless we have a permit. But, we can hold photo contests of harvested animals if it's based on the best photo.
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Offline Axle

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #21 on: January 06, 2019, 04:34:29 PM »
The solution is easy to figure out.
The problem is - people behind a desk are calling the shots and people with voting ballots are changing the rules.
And that is a bad combination!
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Offline konradcountry

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #22 on: January 19, 2019, 09:27:32 AM »
My idea was the Predator Incentive Point System.  PIPS


Shooting various predators would give incentive points to something like a quality buck or elk, the idea is that if a hunter has killed enough predators they've earned that huge buck in a quality unit, during a quality hunt window.  The details could be worked out later, I'd just like to get this idea of PIPS out there floating around.

I think this is a good idea but you would have to be really careful in this state. 

The King County and California voters association of Washington would flip out over the idea of a bounty system for any furry predators. 

But I think it is still worth exploring.

Offline konradcountry

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #23 on: January 19, 2019, 09:51:35 AM »
There is only one way to effectively manage predators.  And that is to use tools that we are not allowed to use in WA.  Such as dogs, bait and steel traps.  Without these things there is no such thing as predator control.

I'm not convinced that our predator problems would go away if bait and dogs were allowed. A decrease sure but I'm not convinced that is the main problem.

There are a lot of tools for coyote hunting yet there are areas where they are everywhere. In fact when it comes to coyote we have very few restrictions outside of trapping. A lot of states don't allow night hunting of any kind and also restrict seasons/calibers.

Offline Tracker0721

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #24 on: January 19, 2019, 10:59:21 AM »
I usually do a lot of coyote hunting and the only issue I see is we can’t use foothold traps. I’ve got a million places i’d have traps on my way to work. There’s enough guys out blaring their foxpros, the issue is those that are serious and dedicating days off and weeknights to go call are calling educated dogs. Footholds would be awesome. Hounds for cougar and bear would be great too. Not only be able to harvest more but to be able to identify sex and age before shooting. Smarter and more efficient predator control.
May my presence go unnoticed, may my shot be true, may the blood trail be short.

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Offline KFhunter

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #25 on: January 19, 2019, 11:46:03 AM »
I usually do a lot of coyote hunting and the only issue I see is we can’t use foothold traps. I’ve got a million places i’d have traps on my way to work. There’s enough guys out blaring their foxpros, the issue is those that are serious and dedicating days off and weeknights to go call are calling educated dogs. Footholds would be awesome. Hounds for cougar and bear would be great too. Not only be able to harvest more but to be able to identify sex and age before shooting. Smarter and more efficient predator control.

Oh, man to have footholds again....I'd slay em.  I've been building snowmobile trails all over the place and the dogs just LOVE snowmobile trails.


foot holds are a fantasy though, with protected wolves roaming around there's zero chance of changing that any time soon.  Perhaps if the wolves do so much damage on the west side public sentiment changes drastically....

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Re: The real problem with predator control
« Reply #26 on: January 19, 2019, 12:09:29 PM »
guilty  to a point  on not wanting to ruin deer hunt by blasting yote   only ever had chance at one bear would like to get into hunting them more not just having tag in pocket  have my cougar tag as well never seen one ever wsince spending more time chasing elk on firing center  its almost impossible to not see a yote and get snow it looks like there are hundreds would love to get over there  just for them  maybe different gun  also maybe state do some kind of bounty on yotes  or earn deer elk tag  or something like that   

 


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Best gear shop? by highside74
[Yesterday at 10:03:17 PM]


New fisher looking to catch some pinks this year by actionshooter
[Yesterday at 09:16:44 PM]


Looking for grouse hunting or pheasant hunting friend by raydog
[Yesterday at 09:11:26 PM]


Looking for English Pointer pup (Elhew and/or Guard Rail lines) by Tafinder
[Yesterday at 08:17:05 PM]


Commercial crab pots going in today. by storyteller
[Yesterday at 07:31:14 PM]


free fishing weekend but not all is included! PSA by MADMAX
[Yesterday at 07:24:55 PM]


Jetty Fishing by jackelope
[Yesterday at 06:10:56 PM]


where is everyone? by dagon
[Yesterday at 01:23:20 PM]


What is the VA Funding Fee and Its Purpose? by pianoman9701
[Yesterday at 10:43:39 AM]


Brittany breeders by Wingin it
[June 03, 2025, 10:31:28 PM]

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