Restricting rifles for grouse to rimfires

[Humptulips]

What say you?
I'm against. Shot the head off too many grouse with my deer rifle.

https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-08/smallgameproposals_public.pdf

[wadu1]

What say you?
I'm against. Shot the head off too many grouse with my deer rifle.

https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-08/smallgameproposals_public.pdf

I'm against as ,well for the same reason, my .54 muzzy does a job on the head.

[predatorpro]

How does it benefit hunters?

[brokentrail]

I'm against this change.  The reasoning stated isn't a good reason imo.  I have shot the head off of a few grouse with a centerfire rifle and didn't waste anything edible.  I have also missed way more than I harvested as I was trying to head shoot them.

[pianoman9701]

Also have shot heads off with a .30-30. If they're worried about game wastage, they can enforce existing laws if someone blows a grouse apart with a centerfire rifle. 

[hunter399]

With this proposal is to :
Not start the grouse season till Sept 15
Spring "permit" season for grouse.

They say grouse population is in the dumpster cause nobody's puts any wings in those stupid barrels any more.

They want to Shorten the season,but at the same time make a boat load of money from spring permits.

Then make it Rim fire only.

How about we don't change anything and WDFW doesn't line there pockets.

Ok EVERYBODY pick your poison let the decusion rip!

[pianoman9701]

 
@daveworkman

[Magnum_Willys]

Shot heads off 9 straight one year in idaho with 300 win mag during season.   When I think about Puget Sound newbies shooting rifles down roads I can see where the concerns are comng from.   Im for old school no change tho. 

[Bill W]

I could see it be rimfire rifles only if the shooter isn't licensed for big game in the appropriate modern firearm season.

[MADMAX]

Personally
Nowadays I wouldn’t waste my big game ammo on a 2 dollar grouse
Just sayin
I vote no rule change

[bigtex]

If they're worried about game wastage, they can enforce existing laws if someone blows a grouse apart with a centerfire rifle. 

No they cannot.

Imagine this, guy gets cited for wasting a grouse because he blew it apart with a centerfire rifle. Guy goes to court, what's he/his lawyer going to say? Well WDFW said I can shoot a grouse with a centerfire rifle, blame WDFW. And of course they can't say "only head shots" that won't stand up in court as well.

[Alchase]

Plus you do not even have to hit them, just put the 300 WM bullet next to their head the shock knocks them senseless. You can walk up and ring their neck.
Or do what I normally do, take their head off.

Sometimes I think they make these rules up to justify their jobs. No sense in most of them.

[Hillbilly Zen]

Ya gotta make sure those grouse are anchored!  🤪  Good grief they will want to require dogs one day.  Let a person shoot a grouse with whatever they want.   Maybe we should go to calling them in only?  Grouse calling.  You know you have all tried it!

[JimmyHoffa]

I'm against the change--been working on a 22 hornet grouse gun.

My guess is someone either complained or WDFW dreamed up the scenario of guys shooting grouse out of trees or skipping rounds down roads with their .338s mags.  Or maybe it would have something to do with allowing .223 for deer (proposed)--kind of like the no rounds larger than .24 unless you had deer/elk/bear tag.

[sagerat]

Absolute joke. Leave the rules alone, somebody’s trying to justify all the “grouse research” they’ve done. “Need to improve things somehow”. I for one will not be applying for any rediculous spring “permit only” seasons they dream up.

[Alchase]

Ya gotta make sure those grouse are anchored!  🤪  Good grief they will want to require dogs one day.  Let a person shoot a grouse with whatever they want.   Maybe we should go to calling them in only?  Grouse calling.  You know you have all tried it!

I can see it now, tons of hunters sitting on logs beating fake wings on logs! 

[KFhunter]

This is stupid, no one gonna be shooting grouse with nearly impossible to find precious ammo

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[Sitka_Blacktail]

Seriously? I have done way more damage to grouse with a shotgun than I ever did with a rifle.  Did they do a study that identified this as a problem? Or was it just somebody's "feelings"?

[Griiz]

I used to put a little unique pistol powder in my 30’06 case, lightly tamp a 00 buck pellet into neck and carry them for shooting grouse. It was like shooting them with a 22. Worked great.

[Smokepole]

I call bs on their stated purpose.  The main issue is over harvest, so why don't they just come out and say it?  A big percentage of grouse are taken by deer and bear hunters, during big game seasons.   By eliminating centerfire rifles, they can reduce the number of birds taken, and increase holdover birds for breeding.  They should just say it in print, and be honest with people.  Once a bird is dead, it's dead -- whether you eat it or not.

I've been carrying a .22 pistol for years while hunting deer.  It's challenging to pop a grouse with a handgun.  I'm apposed to weekend hunters flinging high-caliber lead at anything that walks, slithers, or crawls.  It's more of a safety issue IMHO.  Lots of grouse are harvested in the road.  Often times there's alcohol in the truck.  That's why I go back to my cabin during modern and don't come out until the show is over.

Another point...  I hunting ruffed grouse at the home place as a boy well into my adult years.  I could flush 10 birds during a short outing with my dog.  Always come home with a couple nice ones for dinner.  I always saved some birds for seed, so that next year I could enjoy the same experience.  Then new guy moved in with a whole different mentality.  Each year he harvested up to 75 birds in his quest to fill his freezer for his Thanksgiving party.  Needless to say, grouse hunting now sucks, county wide.

Wasting a little meat with a high power rifle isn't the issue here.  Give me a break.  WDFW could start by telling the Truth about their intended purpose.

 

 



 

 

[KFhunter]

Agree with above, but I just don't think hunters have much impact on overall grouse numbers, especially with mod centerfire. For every grouse a hunter takes how many are taken by raptors, bobcat, coyotes taking hens off nests, weasels/ermine, owls any everything else that takes grouse?  There's only so many grouse that frequent roads, and a whole lot that don't.

In most articles you find they always scream habitat habitat habitat! But if you look beyond that tired old mantra there's not a lot of info on why the decline.


I still think there should be a study on turkey raiding grouse nests, and competition for food resources.


https://kb.osu.edu/handle/1811/23510


https://www.oregonlive.com/sports/oregonian/bill_monroe/2011/10/do_turkeys_replace_ruffed_or_b.html

https://www.wxpr.org/post/do-turkeys-eat-grouse

[KFhunter]

I think this is a "feels" thing, someone with a voice throwing centerfires under the bus because it's not "true" grouse hunting. Ground sluecing...

"If you don't do it my way, you shouldn't do it at all"

And using declining grouse numbers as leverage to get it done, even though tbe impact to grouse numbers would be negligible.

[JimmyHoffa]

I think this is a "feels" thing, someone with a voice throwing centerfires under the bus because it's not "true" grouse hunting. Ground sluecing...

"If you don't do it my way, you shouldn't do it at all"

And using declining grouse numbers as leverage to get it done, even though tbe impact to grouse numbers would be negligible.

Do you see a lot of dedicated, purist grouse hunters over there?  Occasionally there are grouse only hunters driving around on the coast, but I think the rain keeps the interest over to the dry side.
The way you worded it sounds a lot like what happen(s/ed) for fish.

[Humptulips]

I have to admit I do not shoot at many grouse with my big game rifle anymore. I do remember when I was a boy my Dad letting me shoot at every grouse we saw with the old thirty thirty. I think that is a good way to keep interest in hunting when the shooting opportunities are far and few between, Might be the difference between fanning the spark of interest in hunting or losing a kid to video games or the like.

[Norman89]

At this point I see no one at wdfw without special interest. It's a political group that bows to those with the most money in special interest groups. Time and time again in our state I watch as people send in there comments, and only the money benefit is what gets pushed through. Special permits? Ya I see that coming for sure. No I don't agree. I get anoyed carrying a shotgun while deer and elk hunting. Even packing a 22 rifle gets anoying. This year switched to a 22 revolver and was much more comfortable, specially since a 300wm cost in the neighborhood of 2.50$ a shot now I'd prefer not to waste the ammo if I miss. Only ethical headshots are taken, on the ground or with a safe back drop. I won't shoot a grouse in a tree with a center fire or 22 with no close up backstop. Yes lots of new hunters in the woods just out to get there first self provided meal after covid bs lockdowns and people hurting for cash to provide the home with food on the table I understand that. Every person on edge with the government both national and state. The way I see it, the more restrictions they decide to impose upon us who must pay the masters for our privledge of providing a healthy meal for our family's, the more people will embrace the lawlessness. Already see it every day out running my trapline, discovered a poached cow elk last night. People don't care about the regs, they will do what's neccesary to put food in the freezer. And then others will follow suit since they don't see those offenders paying for it. Just like the current political landscape, no reprocussions for breaking the law and game wardens have far less resources to cover ground and catch them and prosecute them. Long rant short, wa is heading down the drain of death by a thousand cuts and descending into lawlessness. I'm not for it, I will make that clear. But just my  rant over. Leave the regs alone

[HntnFsh]

If they were truly worried about low grouse numbers on this side of the state they should try looking at the effect fertilizer has on them when spread on the tree farms.

[Alan K]

And not have increased the bag limit. 

[KFhunter]

Of all the things killing grouse 24/7  365 what % of grouse mortality do you all think is from hunters?

5%

10?

50%

I say prolly less than 1-2%!   with 99% of that 1% within 50 feet of a road!

Weather is high 70% some years and hawks/owls is 30% with other predators bagging the rest of the majority.

I dunno why people think hunting is the biggest threat to consumable wildlife except in certian high pressure areas witb certain species like elk.


We don't need more restrictions, we need less hawks, owls and turkey and more trapping of yotes, bobs and weasels/ermine.




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[konradcountry]

Of all the things killing grouse 24/7  365 what % of grouse mortality do you all think is from hunters?
...
I say prolly less than 1-2%!   with 99% of that 1% within 50 feet of a road!

This is what I would guess. 1% at the most. There is no way that the occasional grouse taken by a modern hunter affects the population.

Non-hunting areas should be covered in grouse if hunters are the problem. That isn't the case.

I hike areas where hunting is banned and never see them.

In fact the area where I know to look has a lot of hunters.

[Bullkllr]

I dunno why people think hunting is the biggest threat to consumable wildlife except in certian high pressure areas witb certain species like elk. 

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I think you'd be hard-pressed to find anyone with a clue who thinks that, especially regarding grouse. While it's hard to argue that many at the DFW seem to have much of a clue, I don't think even they believe hunters are having much impact; we're just the easiest factor to control (as usual).

[Ghost Hunter]

No discussion on maximum arrow weight for grouse?  Max bow draw?  Bread crumb nocks legal?  Haven't looked, but how available is non-lead ammo for pellet guns?  Head spinning....

[elksnout]

Ruffed grouse populations are cyclic with a population peak every ten years according to a quick google search.


Elksnout

[sagerat]

 

What grouse decline? Yeah there’s better years than others but I still find them in very good numbers with minimal effort.