Year round Bull Elk season

[Rainier10]

I don't think it is right but it is their right.  (See what I did there?)

I will say that I think there is just as big of a problem from the non native side.  I think if you stop illegal harvest by non natives you would see game numbers increase.  Once we get people to follow the rules and seasons in place we can look at the abuse by tribal members exercising their rights.

I look at it this way.  Everyone says our moose populations are hurting and yet every member on here that draws a moose tag this year is going to do everything they can to harvest a moose.  Every permit holder last year and the year before did the same thing.  Why?  Because they had a tag, they had the right and they wanted to fill that tag, exercise that right before their were no more moose to hunt or the opportunity was taken away.

Our elk are in the same spot.  Is it because of tribal overharvest or is it because everyone that has an OTC spike tag or special permit bull or cow tag this year is going to do their best to fill it?  If people feel so strongly about the numbers of elk and moose we have don't fill your tag.  People that are against hunting do it all the time. They buy tags they never intend to use.  Control what you can.  Right now there is nothing that you can do about tribal rights. ( I did it again) 

You can control what you do, make the personal decision to not exercise your right to harvest an elk OTC or with that coveted special permit but don't hunt and then complain that someone else is exercising their right.  Don't exercise yours and someone should exercise theirs less so you can enjoy yours more.

You're joking right? Are you seriously trying to compare tribal hunters having an open season on elk all year to a once in a lifetime moose tag?  You really think more elk are poached by non natives then what natives shoot? The only thing you've said that I agree with is people will hunt because they can. Exactly why tribes need stricter seasons. It takes a non native years to draw a tag and a native can shoot big bulls every year. Non natives are restricted so we have elk to hunt for future generations.  Doesn't work when another group of people slaughter them.

I'm not joking at all.  If everyone that had a moose tag this year passed the number of moose would go up as long as the habitat could handle it.  I 100% believe that just as many elk are shot by poachers as by the few tribal members that shoot multiple elk.  There are those tribal members that only shoot one a year and many tribal members that never shoot an elk. If we are comparing natives that overharvest and non natives that overharvest I am positive the non native over harvesters take way more animals.

If you truly think our deer and elk are on life support quit hunting deer and elk.  Spend your entire season shooting predators.  You can kill two bears, one cougar and as many coyotes as you want in this state.  If every hunter that thinks our deer and elk are on life support just took a couple years off hunting deer and elk and only shot predators we would have tons of wildlife.

I actually spend a ton of time predator hunting. You're an idiot if you think tribal hunting isn't an issue in the blues. They shot more bulls in there last year than we are even given permits for in the short seasons we have.

Good for you on the predator hunting.

I'm an idiot?  Interesting.

[dvolmer]

This thread is nonsense.   Natives aren’t killing all of our elk along with wolves, bears, and cats!!!  It’s puppy dog farts, butterfly wings, and Fairy dust that has decimated the herds in the last 5-10 years. You are all to insensitive and hurtful!  You should all be ashamed of yourselves for mentioning otherwise!!!

[Jonathan_S]

I don't think it is right but it is their right.  (See what I did there?)

I will say that I think there is just as big of a problem from the non native side.  I think if you stop illegal harvest by non natives you would see game numbers increase.  Once we get people to follow the rules and seasons in place we can look at the abuse by tribal members exercising their rights.

I look at it this way.  Everyone says our moose populations are hurting and yet every member on here that draws a moose tag this year is going to do everything they can to harvest a moose.  Every permit holder last year and the year before did the same thing.  Why?  Because they had a tag, they had the right and they wanted to fill that tag, exercise that right before their were no more moose to hunt or the opportunity was taken away.

Our elk are in the same spot.  Is it because of tribal overharvest or is it because everyone that has an OTC spike tag or special permit bull or cow tag this year is going to do their best to fill it?  If people feel so strongly about the numbers of elk and moose we have don't fill your tag.  People that are against hunting do it all the time. They buy tags they never intend to use.  Control what you can.  Right now there is nothing that you can do about tribal rights. ( I did it again) 

You can control what you do, make the personal decision to not exercise your right to harvest an elk OTC or with that coveted special permit but don't hunt and then complain that someone else is exercising their right.  Don't exercise yours and someone should exercise theirs less so you can enjoy yours more.

You're joking right? Are you seriously trying to compare tribal hunters having an open season on elk all year to a once in a lifetime moose tag?  You really think more elk are poached by non natives then what natives shoot? The only thing you've said that I agree with is people will hunt because they can. Exactly why tribes need stricter seasons. It takes a non native years to draw a tag and a native can shoot big bulls every year. Non natives are restricted so we have elk to hunt for future generations.  Doesn't work when another group of people slaughter them.

I'm not joking at all.  If everyone that had a moose tag this year passed the number of moose would go up as long as the habitat could handle it.  I 100% believe that just as many elk are shot by poachers as by the few tribal members that shoot multiple elk.  There are those tribal members that only shoot one a year and many tribal members that never shoot an elk. If we are comparing natives that overharvest and non natives that overharvest I am positive the non native over harvesters take way more animals.

If you truly think our deer and elk are on life support quit hunting deer and elk.  Spend your entire season shooting predators.  You can kill two bears, one cougar and as many coyotes as you want in this state.  If every hunter that thinks our deer and elk are on life support just took a couple years off hunting deer and elk and only shot predators we would have tons of wildlife.

I actually spend a ton of time predator hunting. You're an idiot if you think tribal hunting isn't an issue in the blues. They shot more bulls in there last year than we are even given permits for in the short seasons we have.

Where did Rainier10 say tribal harvest isn't an issue? Only thing I've read him saying that there is also non-tribal take that presents an issue and is a lot easier to address 

[Rainier10]

I am sure @Maverick is passionate about the elk in the blues.  I don't recall mentioning a specific area or unit.  I certainly wouldn't rule out that in one particular herd or in one GMU natives harvest more bulls than non natives are given permits.  I will stand behind my belief that for every animal that people think are overharvested statewide by a select few tribal members there are just as many animals taken illegally by non tribal members.

It is great that people are passionate about their favorite herd, gmu or quarry but there is a bigger picture also.  There are more herds, there are more gmu's and there are more animals than just deer and elk.  I am sure there are a few GMU's where non native poaching far exceeds what the native take is and others where native harvest exceeds non native poaching.  It goes both ways.

[idaho guy]

I don't think it is right but it is their right.  (See what I did there?)

I will say that I think there is just as big of a problem from the non native side.  I think if you stop illegal harvest by non natives you would see game numbers increase.  Once we get people to follow the rules and seasons in place we can look at the abuse by tribal members exercising their rights.

I look at it this way.  Everyone says our moose populations are hurting and yet every member on here that draws a moose tag this year is going to do everything they can to harvest a moose.  Every permit holder last year and the year before did the same thing.  Why?  Because they had a tag, they had the right and they wanted to fill that tag, exercise that right before their were no more moose to hunt or the opportunity was taken away.

Our elk are in the same spot.  Is it because of tribal overharvest or is it because everyone that has an OTC spike tag or special permit bull or cow tag this year is going to do their best to fill it?  If people feel so strongly about the numbers of elk and moose we have don't fill your tag.  People that are against hunting do it all the time. They buy tags they never intend to use.  Control what you can.  Right now there is nothing that you can do about tribal rights. ( I did it again) 

You can control what you do, make the personal decision to not exercise your right to harvest an elk OTC or with that coveted special permit but don't hunt and then complain that someone else is exercising their right.  Don't exercise yours and someone should exercise theirs less so you can enjoy yours more.

You're joking right? Are you seriously trying to compare tribal hunters having an open season on elk all year to a once in a lifetime moose tag?  You really think more elk are poached by non natives then what natives shoot? The only thing you've said that I agree with is people will hunt because they can. Exactly why tribes need stricter seasons. It takes a non native years to draw a tag and a native can shoot big bulls every year. Non natives are restricted so we have elk to hunt for future generations.  Doesn't work when another group of people slaughter them.

I'm not joking at all.  If everyone that had a moose tag this year passed the number of moose would go up as long as the habitat could handle it.  I 100% believe that just as many elk are shot by poachers as by the few tribal members that shoot multiple elk.  There are those tribal members that only shoot one a year and many tribal members that never shoot an elk. If we are comparing natives that overharvest and non natives that overharvest I am positive the non native over harvesters take way more animals.

If you truly think our deer and elk are on life support quit hunting deer and elk.  Spend your entire season shooting predators.  You can kill two bears, one cougar and as many coyotes as you want in this state.  If every hunter that thinks our deer and elk are on life support just took a couple years off hunting deer and elk and only shot predators we would have tons of wildlife.

   


  I have agreed with this for years. I dont think you need to give up elk or deer but if hunters would spend even equal time hunting predators it would make a world of difference. The plus is with all the pro predator groups pushing more and more on the landscape we could be living in the "good ole days" of predator hunting  At this point in my hunting lifetime I spend more time hunting and trapping predators but still do a lot of deer and elk hunting. I think its just a mind set that alot of hunters grew up with to just hunt elk and deer. Hunt predators and bears and lions taste great 

[coachcw]

makes to great management , sure its there right . but what about all the other cuts and tax breaks that they get that they didn't before , time for things to be adjusted .

[Whitefoot]

makes to great management , sure its there right . but what about all the other cuts and tax breaks that they get that they didn't before , time for things to be adjusted .

SMH! 

[trophyhunt]

makes to great management , sure its there right . but what about all the other cuts and tax breaks that they get that they didn't before , time for things to be adjusted .

SMH!

”SMH!”  Is that how you feel about management ? 

[emac]

I don't think it is right but it is their right.  (See what I did there?)

I will say that I think there is just as big of a problem from the non native side.  I think if you stop illegal harvest by non natives you would see game numbers increase.  Once we get people to follow the rules and seasons in place we can look at the abuse by tribal members exercising their rights.

I look at it this way.  Everyone says our moose populations are hurting and yet every member on here that draws a moose tag this year is going to do everything they can to harvest a moose.  Every permit holder last year and the year before did the same thing.  Why?  Because they had a tag, they had the right and they wanted to fill that tag, exercise that right before their were no more moose to hunt or the opportunity was taken away.

Our elk are in the same spot.  Is it because of tribal overharvest or is it because everyone that has an OTC spike tag or special permit bull or cow tag this year is going to do their best to fill it?  If people feel so strongly about the numbers of elk and moose we have don't fill your tag.  People that are against hunting do it all the time. They buy tags they never intend to use.  Control what you can.  Right now there is nothing that you can do about tribal rights. ( I did it again) 

You can control what you do, make the personal decision to not exercise your right to harvest an elk OTC or with that coveted special permit but don't hunt and then complain that someone else is exercising their right.  Don't exercise yours and someone should exercise theirs less so you can enjoy yours more.

You're joking right? Are you seriously trying to compare tribal hunters having an open season on elk all year to a once in a lifetime moose tag?  You really think more elk are poached by non natives then what natives shoot? The only thing you've said that I agree with is people will hunt because they can. Exactly why tribes need stricter seasons. It takes a non native years to draw a tag and a native can shoot big bulls every year. Non natives are restricted so we have elk to hunt for future generations.  Doesn't work when another group of people slaughter them.

I'm not joking at all.  If everyone that had a moose tag this year passed the number of moose would go up as long as the habitat could handle it.  I 100% believe that just as many elk are shot by poachers as by the few tribal members that shoot multiple elk.  There are those tribal members that only shoot one a year and many tribal members that never shoot an elk. If we are comparing natives that overharvest and non natives that overharvest I am positive the non native over harvesters take way more animals.

If you truly think our deer and elk are on life support quit hunting deer and elk.  Spend your entire season shooting predators.  You can kill two bears, one cougar and as many coyotes as you want in this state.  If every hunter that thinks our deer and elk are on life support just took a couple years off hunting deer and elk and only shot predators we would have tons of wildlife.

I actually spend a ton of time predator hunting. You're an idiot if you think tribal hunting isn't an issue in the blues. They shot more bulls in there last year than we are even given permits for in the short seasons we have.

You would have to add up permit numbers for probably 10 years to add up to what they take in a year

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[emac]

One thing people never talk about and I'd like to have a better understanding of. The elk were introduced here in Kittitas county in the 1910s and 1920s for hunting, how can tribes claim tribal hunting rights to a species that is not native and people paid to introduce? Not saying its wrong they have the right, just wondering how is works since the elk are not native.

Elk are native, they certainly existed at the time the Treaties were signed, and so my guess is people don't talk about it much because there is no legitimacy to suggest tribes shouldn't kill elk.

When were the treaties signed.

I know elk were not native to the blues.  They came on a train from Yellowstone.

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[OutHouse]

makes to great management , sure its there right . but what about all the other cuts and tax breaks that they get that they didn't before , time for things to be adjusted .

They try to "adjust" things all the time but when the government goes to court with the Yakamas they get beat like an old drum nearly every time. Government has buyer's remorse on the treaties.

[Platensek-po]

One thing people never talk about and I'd like to have a better understanding of. The elk were introduced here in Kittitas county in the 1910s and 1920s for hunting, how can tribes claim tribal hunting rights to a species that is not native and people paid to introduce? Not saying its wrong they have the right, just wondering how is works since the elk are not native.

Elk are native, they certainly existed at the time the Treaties were signed, and so my guess is people don't talk about it much because there is no legitimacy to suggest tribes shouldn't kill elk.

When were the treaties signed.

I know elk were not native to the blues.  They came on a train from Yellowstone.

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Elk were 100% native to these areas. That they had been hunted till they were wiped out of those areas might be, but natives hunted elk in Washington for 14k years before that. Would be like saying bison aren’t native to Washington because they had been removed and never came back. They certainly are native. Remember most of these species went extinct due to over hunting and most of that over hunting was not done by the tribes.

[idahohuntr]

One thing people never talk about and I'd like to have a better understanding of. The elk were introduced here in Kittitas county in the 1910s and 1920s for hunting, how can tribes claim tribal hunting rights to a species that is not native and people paid to introduce? Not saying its wrong they have the right, just wondering how is works since the elk are not native.

Elk are native, they certainly existed at the time the Treaties were signed, and so my guess is people don't talk about it much because there is no legitimacy to suggest tribes shouldn't kill elk.

When were the treaties signed.

I know elk were not native to the blues.  They came on a train from Yellowstone.

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Elk were 100% native to these areas. That they had been hunted till they were wiped out of those areas might be, but natives hunted elk in Washington for 14k years before that. Would be like saying bison aren’t native to Washington because they had been removed and never came back. They certainly are native. Remember most of these species went extinct due to over hunting and most of that over hunting was not done by the tribes.

Precisely.  I'm always amazed at the number of hunters who do not know this...or that think elk are not native.  The fact they were hunted to near extinction (not by tribes) and were supplemented by yellowstone herds is often where the confusion appears to arise. 

[idahohuntr]

makes to great management , sure its there right . but what about all the other cuts and tax breaks that they get that they didn't before , time for things to be adjusted .

They try to "adjust" things all the time but when the government goes to court with the Yakamas they get beat like an old drum nearly every time. Government has buyer's remorse on the treaties.

Depends on the specific case, but in a large number of major cases it is actually the United States stepping in on behalf of the Tribe to enforce their treaties on an errant state...like OR, WA, or more recently WY.  Its not the Yakamas beating the 'government'...its the United States taking a belt to the States on behalf of the Yakamas (and other tribes). 

Also...the US Congress has plenary power over tribes and can adjust any aspect of tribal treaties they want...Congress could terminate every tribal treaty tomorrow if they so desired. 

[Rainier10]

I don't think it is right but it is their right.  (See what I did there?)

I will say that I think there is just as big of a problem from the non native side.  I think if you stop illegal harvest by non natives you would see game numbers increase.  Once we get people to follow the rules and seasons in place we can look at the abuse by tribal members exercising their rights.

I look at it this way.  Everyone says our moose populations are hurting and yet every member on here that draws a moose tag this year is going to do everything they can to harvest a moose.  Every permit holder last year and the year before did the same thing.  Why?  Because they had a tag, they had the right and they wanted to fill that tag, exercise that right before their were no more moose to hunt or the opportunity was taken away.

Our elk are in the same spot.  Is it because of tribal overharvest or is it because everyone that has an OTC spike tag or special permit bull or cow tag this year is going to do their best to fill it?  If people feel so strongly about the numbers of elk and moose we have don't fill your tag.  People that are against hunting do it all the time. They buy tags they never intend to use.  Control what you can.  Right now there is nothing that you can do about tribal rights. ( I did it again) 

You can control what you do, make the personal decision to not exercise your right to harvest an elk OTC or with that coveted special permit but don't hunt and then complain that someone else is exercising their right.  Don't exercise yours and someone should exercise theirs less so you can enjoy yours more.

You're joking right? Are you seriously trying to compare tribal hunters having an open season on elk all year to a once in a lifetime moose tag?  You really think more elk are poached by non natives then what natives shoot? The only thing you've said that I agree with is people will hunt because they can. Exactly why tribes need stricter seasons. It takes a non native years to draw a tag and a native can shoot big bulls every year. Non natives are restricted so we have elk to hunt for future generations.  Doesn't work when another group of people slaughter them.

I'm not joking at all.  If everyone that had a moose tag this year passed the number of moose would go up as long as the habitat could handle it.  I 100% believe that just as many elk are shot by poachers as by the few tribal members that shoot multiple elk.  There are those tribal members that only shoot one a year and many tribal members that never shoot an elk. If we are comparing natives that overharvest and non natives that overharvest I am positive the non native over harvesters take way more animals.

If you truly think our deer and elk are on life support quit hunting deer and elk.  Spend your entire season shooting predators.  You can kill two bears, one cougar and as many coyotes as you want in this state.  If every hunter that thinks our deer and elk are on life support just took a couple years off hunting deer and elk and only shot predators we would have tons of wildlife.

I actually spend a ton of time predator hunting. You're an idiot if you think tribal hunting isn't an issue in the blues. They shot more bulls in there last year than we are even given permits for in the short seasons we have.

You would have to add up permit numbers for probably 10 years to add up to what they take in a year

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Are you adding up permit numbers to compare what predators take each year or the natives? I’m pretty sure if you look at predations numbers they will total more than the native harvest and we keep introducing new predators.