Frustrated with Washington BHA event Free the Snake

[idaho guy]

Knock out all the dams. Every last one. Ancient tech that’s extremely outdated and not needed. Seals and birds would do a lot less harm if the fish weren’t trapped at the bases of the dams. Cant think of anything better than seeing the snake and the Columbia completely free of dams.

On another note, every time some bashes BHA on this site they never have anything they can actually pinpoint as to why. Its always their “agenda”, which they cant seem to explain, or they support something like better rivers for salmon so therefor I don’t like them…

Old fashioned and the MOST renewable energy source on the planet with no emissions. So California said nothing but electric vehicles by 2035. How are we going to power those? Coal fired power plants? That’s what you got without hydroelectric power. Sorry the windmills just aren’t quite getting it done. How about invest new technology INTO hydroelectric power? We could make fish ladders that clone salmon on the way over the damn with half the investment we have put into new “green” energy. We need to invest more in new and better hydroelectric power not get rid of it. It’s not the political correct renewable energy source but it’s by far the best.

[idaho guy]

Not to derail too much but a guy at work and I were both discussing these dams and neither of us has enough info to form an opinion but he asked why no one is talking about an improved fish ladder system or those fish cannons or? Surely for the financial cost of removing them a better fish return system could be funded maybe?

As for BHA, they're a mission focused organization and this seems on mission for them. Like them or not but they're doing what they say they do aren't they?

   


This has been my question? What’s more renewable than hydroelectric power? Nothing and the river keeps flowing constantly. Why aren’t we investing in new technology for hydroelectric? With modern technology we could get every fish across any dam. I look at my iPhone I’m typing on and everything it can do and wonder why we don’t apply new technology to and old but reliable energy source. Hydroelectric was GREEN before it was cool ! Some people just don’t like to see a dam on their “backcountry “ fishing trip. Apparently giant wind farms don’t ruin their outdoor experience

[idaho guy]

How would you wet siders feel if every ridge line you looked at had windmills?

Any vast plateau you live by was proposed for a solar farm?

Read the news. They want to line the Horse Heaven hills with windmills, cover the backside of Ratllesnake mtn with a solar farm and i just read they want to put another solar farm south of vantage.

Lets put all this in Puget sound eh? Lets see the west side of the state power everybody

   

They don’t know what they don’t know. When you put in a giant solar farm they sterilize all the soil in the area. You are PERMANENTLY removing habitat from the landscape forever. (Usually sage brush type mule deer habitat) in my opinion the one animal that can least afford habitat losses. Where is Bha on this? At least with an oil field the mule deer can still eat and winter in the area. The oilfield can be reclaimed and returned to prime habitat the solar field can’t and won’t. Hydroelectric is the original green energy but they refuse to invest in it. We’re still using 100 year old technology and it’s our cheapest, most renewable and dependable energy source. Think what could be done with a fraction of the investment thrown at new “green” energy. I don’t even have time to discuss windmills and the detriment they are to birds and the environment

[grundy53]

Spot on

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[Jonathan_S]

Not to derail too much but a guy at work and I were both discussing these dams and neither of us has enough info to form an opinion but he asked why no one is talking about an improved fish ladder system or those fish cannons or? Surely for the financial cost of removing them a better fish return system could be funded maybe?

As for BHA, they're a mission focused organization and this seems on mission for them. Like them or not but they're doing what they say they do aren't they?

The attrition to smolt heading downstream is a bigger problem than the return is what I have heard.

[MeepDog]

Not to derail too much but a guy at work and I were both discussing these dams and neither of us has enough info to form an opinion but he asked why no one is talking about an improved fish ladder system or those fish cannons or? Surely for the financial cost of removing them a better fish return system could be funded maybe?

As for BHA, they're a mission focused organization and this seems on mission for them. Like them or not but they're doing what they say they do aren't they?

   


This has been my question? What’s more renewable than hydroelectric power? Nothing and the river keeps flowing constantly. Why aren’t we investing in new technology for hydroelectric? With modern technology we could get every fish across any dam. I look at my iPhone I’m typing on and everything it can do and wonder why we don’t apply new technology to and old but reliable energy source. Hydroelectric was GREEN before it was cool ! Some people just don’t like to see a dam on their “backcountry “ fishing trip. Apparently giant wind farms don’t ruin their outdoor experience

You're right we seriously need to improve adult fish passage. Even with adult passage at 100%, smolt survival from the predatory fish using the dams habitat will still hinder us. Walleye between priest rapids and mcnary eat 2.5 salmon smolts average per day and that's in one of the most free flowing stretches of water. Slow the water down like the snake and it can't be helping. Wind turbines suck, I work on them for a living, but with pump storage facilities that don't block the flow of the river they can be a reliable power source. Also they don't really kill birds, bats get it the worst.

[idaho guy]

It's nice to see BHA getting so much heat, I was worried people had forgotten what a green decoy the org was after the WA chapter

-fought tooth and nail to save washington spring bear hunting to the very end
-stood up to anti-hunting commissioners in public testimony during the blue mountain cougars
-publicly called out the failure of the commission to prioritize blue mountain elk
-crafted a letter to the governor co-signed by every major national hunting organization about appointing better commissioner
-went on a media blitz about the state of the WDFW commission and threat to hunting in op-eds and podcasts to a national level
-pulled miles of fencing in mule deer habitat
- cleaned up a handful of public shooting sites
-adopted an access site
-hosted meetings for the public to engage directly with WDFW scientists
-helped craft/propose legislation that would prevent bad commissioners from getting appointed
-donated funds and labor to the first hunt foundation's youth deer hunt

all in 2022 so far

I was worried ya'll were going soft on them

   

So they don’t want dams. Fine, what is there stance on giant solar farms? Way more detrimental to habitat and the habitat loss is permanent. Every solar field proposed seems destined for prime mule deer habitat and winter range. They will sterilize all the soil beneath the solar farm. It’s permanently removing mainly mule deer habitat. The one animal that can least afford to lose any more winter range or habitat. Are they using your dollar effectively focusing on the snake river dams? What will replace hydroelectric and what affects will that have on wildlife? I guess we’ll find out.  We could invest a fraction of the green energy billions into hydroelectric and come up with better solutions than basically guessing what might work and live with the consequences. We know what hydroelectric does we don’t know the long term affects of wind and solar. Except that solar most definitely permanently removes habitat forever and windmills kill birds and apparently a lot of bats

[MeepDog]

Idaho guy, I've killed 10 x as many birds driving my truck to a turbine than I've found under a turbine dead. I could count on 1 hand the number of turbine killed birds I've found in 4 years of work.

[idaho guy]

Not to derail too much but a guy at work and I were both discussing these dams and neither of us has enough info to form an opinion but he asked why no one is talking about an improved fish ladder system or those fish cannons or? Surely for the financial cost of removing them a better fish return system could be funded maybe?

As for BHA, they're a mission focused organization and this seems on mission for them. Like them or not but they're doing what they say they do aren't they?

   


This has been my question? What’s more renewable than hydroelectric power? Nothing and the river keeps flowing constantly. Why aren’t we investing in new technology for hydroelectric? With modern technology we could get every fish across any dam. I look at my iPhone I’m typing on and everything it can do and wonder why we don’t apply new technology to and old but reliable energy source. Hydroelectric was GREEN before it was cool ! Some people just don’t like to see a dam on their “backcountry “ fishing trip. Apparently giant wind farms don’t ruin their outdoor experience

You're right we seriously need to improve adult fish passage. Even with adult passage at 100%, smolt survival from the predatory fish using the dams habitat will still hinder us. Walleye between priest rapids and mcnary eat 2.5 salmon smolts average per day and that's in one of the most free flowing stretches of water. Slow the water down like the snake and it can't be helping. Wind turbines suck, I work on them for a living, but with pump storage facilities that don't block the flow of the river they can be a reliable power source. Also they don't really kill birds, bats get it the worst.

   


You are the 1 of only 2 people I know of that work on wind turbines. Both have said wind turbines suck  thanks for the comment I think we have the technology to make fish passage and smolt survival way better. It’s just frustrating that no one will talk about it much less invest or throw government money at it. A guy that owned most of the land in north Idaho a long time ago was investing in getting hydroelectric from all the small creeks in the area. That was 40-50 years ago. Hydroelectric was green before it was cool ha ha. What’s more renewable? Nothing. What’s more reliable? Nothing. What are the emissions? Nothing. What do we invest in it? NOTHING  :chuckle it’s frustrating to me that they want to destroy it when we should consider putting money and new technology into it. We have the technology to have great fish runs and abundant cheap hydroelectric power. There is just no desire from the people making the decisions

[idaho guy]

Idaho guy, I've killed 10 x as many birds driving my truck to a turbine than I've found under a turbine dead. I could count on 1 hand the number of turbine killed birds I've found in 4 years of work.

   


I believe you  i have no real first hand knowledge on turbines killing birds. But I did read about it on the internet lol. I am more opposed to the giant solar farms and the resulting permanent habitat loss. Mostly winter range. I have really become just a pro hydroelectric guy-we haven’t invested hardly anything in new ways to harness hydroelectric power and it makes no sense to me. Worse yet people are working to destroy it rather than improve it

[JimmyHoffa]

Idaho guy, I've killed 10 x as many birds driving my truck to a turbine than I've found under a turbine dead. I could count on 1 hand the number of turbine killed birds I've found in 4 years of work.

Turbines mostly kill large raptors and such--eagles, hawks, etc.  For all species of birds, housecats in suburbia tend to kill over a billion birds annually, I'm guessing not too many eagles or hawks.

[JBG]

Idaho Guy, would you be good with the new nuclear energy start up at Hanford taking over the need for hydro dams?  I gotta think cold, free flowing rivers would greatly benefit wildlife as the dams kind of act like the solar panels and greatly mess up anything under and above them. 

[Jpmiller]

Not to derail too much but a guy at work and I were both discussing these dams and neither of us has enough info to form an opinion but he asked why no one is talking about an improved fish ladder system or those fish cannons or? Surely for the financial cost of removing them a better fish return system could be funded maybe?

As for BHA, they're a mission focused organization and this seems on mission for them. Like them or not but they're doing what they say they do aren't they?

The attrition to smolt heading downstream is a bigger problem than the return is what I have heard.

See, told you I don't know enough! Maybe we fund salmon going up and down stream, that still has to be cheaper than taking down the dams and all the hullabaloo that goes with it.

[Elkaholic daWg]

I'm not surprised one bit. I'm just disappointed I ever gave them money.

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me too. BHA Looks great at first glance but take a deeper look and 

I looked at their Facebook page for a few weeks when I was thinking of joining. They have a deep and passionate hatred of anyone who doesn’t follow their agenda to the letter.. I changed my mind about joining,

Saw their agenda 20 tears ago when I was a WSSA member and they can move in with their buddy Insleaze or your favorite commission members

[Tbar]

I'm not surprised one bit. I'm just disappointed I ever gave them money.

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

me too. BHA Looks great at first glance but take a deeper look and 

I looked at their Facebook page for a few weeks when I was thinking of joining. They have a deep and passionate hatred of anyone who doesn’t follow their agenda to the letter.. I changed my mind about joining,

Saw their agenda 20 tears ago when I was a WSSA member and they can move in with their buddy Insleaze or your favorite commission members

It's funny where the attacks are coming from.  Show me a more active group calling out the commission right now. Please! On a side note, I am not a BHA member but have tracked the commission pretty closely.