Fish & Wildlife Commission Special Meeting (Nov. 3-5) Agenda - Spokane

[mulehunter]

Ouch...   

Mulehunter

[CedarPants]

Just now:

"The letter needs to get to the agency first, then I am am more than happy to send it to you next week....please send me your email - dhowell@rmef.org"

[whacker1]

The actual number of breeding pairs?  Anyones guess.  5 we were told today.  That does not count 2 BPs on the Washington Oregon border in the Blues.  That does not count the pack that frequents Tekoa Butte.  That does not count the pack that is in and out of Washington on Mica peak.  That does not count the pack that is in and out of Washington on Mount Spokane.  Some of these would be counted if someone happens to see them with two or more pups after December.  This does not count a documented female with pups (some say as many as 20 in the last three years) on the Washington Idaho border 50 miles north of Spokane (she does not fill the criteria, no male).  You should begin to understand that the plan has some issues.

I went to listen to Jay Shepherd last spring when he spoke to the Spokane Audubon society.  They base breeding pairs on where they den with the pups, so more or less where these animals are spotted in the spring with their pups.  the challenge is that they will not be considered a breeding pair unless they have both the alpha male and the female with the pups present.  So, for the border areas of either Canada, Idaho or Oregon.  You get some breeding females and pups that aren't considered a breeding pair, because the alpha is not present and may have come from across the border.  It is a very flawed system based on the fact that we have to use state lines as boundaries that are completely irrelevant to the wolves.

thank you to all of you that attended and testified.  I wasn't able to make it. 

[Sumpnneedskillin]

KREM just had a story on the 12 o'clock news about the meeting.  Lots of images of wolves.  Mentioned the tribes stance, hunters want the State to allow us to hunt them and the ag community is worried.   

Thanks KREM you just made us hunter sound like all we want to do is kill animals.  No mention that our message is the WDFW's plan is flawed!

[KillBilly]

Thank you again so much to everyone that went.  Solid testimony guys, nicely done!

I can't believe the wolves on the Colville reservation completely escaped me as a consideration.  Do they have any breeding pairs?  Do they know how many wolves (roughly) they have?  Does WDFW actively work with them in documenting numbers?
Sounds like the Colvilles are a potentially strong ally for us.

Sebek - did Jay seem sincere?  If we have an active bio genuinely asking to be contacted with wolf sightings (and genuinely wanting to look into it), I think we should make full use of that offer as a group

If I understood the presentation, NO they have NOT worked with the state up to this point but did offer to work with the state, as long as the state understood their purpose in life is to ensure their members continue to have the same numbers of deer, elk and moose to hunt and any threat to that would be dealt with lethally or trap and transplant.  They have documented wolves on the reservation that the State was unaware of....actually the State has no idea what so ever how many wolves we already have, that much was clear!  One of the things that struck me was they have sent off scat samples to verify DNA...they did not send them to the state, they sent them to ID.  They are going to allow 1 breeding pair on the reservation and one breeding pair in another location, that I could not understand, I believe it was near the Canadian border.

I BP on the res and 1 BP on the northern half

[KillBilly]

The tribe was not putting out a solid number, but Peone said they might be looking at 1 BP on the Reservation and 1 BP on the north half and that they planned to manage wolves but didn't have their wolf plan yet. He said something about the tribe being willing to translocate wolves and I had to chuckle. I was told two years ago "The tribe likes eating deer, elk, and moose and don't really want many wolves." and their testimony held true to that. Best part as I see it, the WDFW can't tell them not to kill wolves and Eastern WA is already federally delisted, I just wished they had a larger hunting area in the NE than the just north half. At this point I see the tribe as the only meaningful hope for management in the foreseeable future.

The tribes today can hunt off of the reservation anytime and anywhere they want to. They are allowed to ignore our seasons in most cases too. It may be that being under Federal classification, that they may be the greatest lethal control tool we could want in the delisted area.

[huntnphool]

Well done guys, I understand how difficult it is to be at those meetings and not blow a gasket.

[winshooter88]

Just curious guys, how many of the commissioners were at the meeting? I know that at least 4 of the nine commissioners are leaning toward not accepting the current plan.

[KillBilly]

There were only 5 Commissioners there yesterday. and one of them is definately Pro Plan and stated that it needs to be adopted before the Feds finish their review at the end of Feb.

[KillBilly]

Well done guys, I understand how difficult it is to be at those meetings and not blow a gasket.

Actually Rob I find it more amusing than angering. It is almost surreal at one moment and unreal the next. We pay these folks good money to stutter and stammer when caught trying to sell us crap. When questioned they look at each other then look at the Director, then he tries to answer for them.... it is truly a traveling magic act and animal show.... kinda like the monkey and foot ball thing....

[bearpaw]

The actual number of breeding pairs?  Anyones guess.  5 we were told today.  That does not count 2 BPs on the Washington Oregon border in the Blues.  That does not count the pack that frequents Tekoa Butte.  That does not count the pack that is in and out of Washington on Mica peak.  That does not count the pack that is in and out of Washington on Mount Spokane.  Some of these would be counted if someone happens to see them with two or more pups after December.  This does not count a documented female with pups (some say as many as 20 in the last three years) on the Washington Idaho border 50 miles north of Spokane (she does not fill the criteria, no male).  You should begin to understand that the plan has some issues.

I went to listen to Jay Shepherd last spring when he spoke to the Spokane Audubon society.  They base breeding pairs on where they den with the pups, so more or less where these animals are spotted in the spring with their pups.  the challenge is that they will not be considered a breeding pair unless they have both the alpha male and the female with the pups present.  So, for the border areas of either Canada, Idaho or Oregon.  You get some breeding females and pups that aren't considered a breeding pair, because the alpha is not present and may have come from across the border.  It is a very flawed system based on the fact that we have to use state lines as boundaries that are completely irrelevant to the wolves.

thank you to all of you that attended and testified.  I wasn't able to make it.

A pack must meet all the qulifications for being a "recognized breeding pair" for 3 consecutive years, or they are not counted as a breeding pair. We could have two hundred wolves, but unless WDFW confirms that a breeding pair successfullly breeds and has at least 2 pups at the end of December, for 3 years in a row, they will not be counted.   

[nwwanderer]

Exactly like the monkey and football thing!  Thanks for the accurate assessment.

[bearpaw]

Response from RMEF:

"RMEF has attended some earlier public hearings on this and we have done a thorough review of the plan. Our official comment letter on the plan will be going out today"

I requested a copy of the official comment letter

Another person called the Missoula main office and was told they didn't know about the meeting, he was given the name of a guy here in Washington who is supposed to represent RMEF that can be called:   Mike Hale 509-826-5571

[CedarPants]

Response from RMEF:

"RMEF has attended some earlier public hearings on this and we have done a thorough review of the plan. Our official comment letter on the plan will be going out today"

I requested a copy of the official comment letter

Another person called the Missoula main office and was told they didn't know about the meeting, he was given the name of a guy here in Washington who is supposed to represent RMEF that can be called:   Mike Hale 509-826-5571

Contacted them directly today via email, just over an hour ago they emailed me a copy of the letter they sent to WDFW.  I posted it here:

http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,86862.0.html

[KillBilly]

I read the letter, no comment.