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Author Topic: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points  (Read 3209 times)

Offline CarbonHunter

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #15 on: April 27, 2018, 02:31:20 PM »
The ability was open to everyone just like an access road that most people donít know about that leads to a good hunting spot. The ability for the kids to start building points early in life is just a way for them to compete against hunters who have been applying for a long time. How are you supposed to get kids interested in hunting by telling them they have to apply for another 40 years to get a moose tag. Itís a little easier to swallow if you tell them they already have 10 points so they are 25% of the way there.

Offline Bob33

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #16 on: April 27, 2018, 02:44:56 PM »
I don't have a strong opinion about it either way, but permits are a zero sum game: when one person gets a permit, it's one less for others to get.

There are plenty of individuals who have been applying for nearly 25 years and are approaching an age where they may be able to hunt much longer. If I had a choice, I would prefer to see them have better odds to get rare permits before they can no longer hunt. :twocents:
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Offline jackelope

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #17 on: April 27, 2018, 02:51:27 PM »
The ability was open to everyone just like an access road that most people don’t know about that leads to a good hunting spot. The ability for the kids to start building points early in life is just a way for them to compete against hunters who have been applying for a long time. How are you supposed to get kids interested in hunting by telling them they have to apply for another 40 years to get a moose tag. It’s a little easier to swallow if you tell them they already have 10 points so they are 25% of the way there.

If it was something that was published or otherwise publicized as something that could be done, I might feel differently. I'm 99.9% positive that there's nothing published anywhere from WDFW saying it's an actual thing and some discovered a loophole at some point. One guy told his buddy who told his buddy who told his buddy and now all of a sudden a bunch of people are doing it. Like I said, I agree with the change.
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Offline emac

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #18 on: April 27, 2018, 02:53:32 PM »
I got my daughter another point in all categories again this year even though she hasnt passed hunters ed. Submitted her point options on monday

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Offline X-Force

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #19 on: April 27, 2018, 02:55:42 PM »
I support the change. I don't think it's fair for some kids to get extra points before they're even eligible to hunt, while other kids don't. This only affects moose, bighorn sheep, and mountain goat anyway, as others have already said. You never could build up points for deer or elk without having passed hunter education, since in order to buy an application you have to first buy a hunting license. I don't believe the state ever intended for people to have the ability to buy moose, sheep, and goat points for their kids. It's just a loophole that some people figured out how to exploit. Most people never knew it was possible.

Looking at it from a what's the most fair to all standpoint, I'm with Bobcat on this one.

It was fare because everyone had the same opportunity. Because some people didn't take advantage of that opportunity it wasn't fair?
This same loop hole is how people out of state can apply for Oil permits without buying a hunting license... is that fair.

It is a shame that this was lost because; 1) kids had the opportunity to acquire points so that when they became old enough to pass hunter ed they could have 8-14 points in the game. 2) These points were relatively cheap so that someone getting of age to buy there own points would be vested in the system and still want to continue to buy points. As it is being 18 or 20 and looking at the odds of drawing and how long it takes to get into the average draw point area (13-16), those people will just sit on there money, not invest in conservation and not pursue hunting... Look at the decrease in hunter participation.... Keep raising the entry bar and we will keep loosing people to the sport. 3) We allow people to apply for 5 species and 22 categories with the dilution of points across the board the odds are so bad why keep everyone; hunters ed or not still in the game?
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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #20 on: April 27, 2018, 02:57:19 PM »
I don't have a strong opinion about it either way, but permits are a zero sum game: when one person gets a permit, it's one less for others to get.

There are plenty of individuals who have been applying for nearly 25 years and are approaching an age where they may be able to hunt much longer. If I had a choice, I would prefer to see them have better odds to get rare permits before they can no longer hunt. :twocents:

screw the future of hunting for the opportunity of the entitled.
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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #21 on: April 27, 2018, 03:01:07 PM »
I don't have a strong opinion about it either way, but permits are a zero sum game: when one person gets a permit, it's one less for others to get.

There are plenty of individuals who have been applying for nearly 25 years and are approaching an age where they may be able to hunt much longer. If I had a choice, I would prefer to see them have better odds to get rare permits before they can no longer hunt. :twocents:

screw the future of hunting for the opportunity of the entitled.

And for the record that is why I hate point systems.
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Offline CarbonHunter

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #22 on: April 27, 2018, 03:05:12 PM »
I don't have a strong opinion about it either way, but permits are a zero sum game: when one person gets a permit, it's one less for others to get.

There are plenty of individuals who have been applying for nearly 25 years and are approaching an age where they may be able to hunt much longer. If I had a choice, I would prefer to see them have better odds to get rare permits before they can no longer hunt. :twocents:

screw the future of hunting for the opportunity of the entitled.

The entitled ones are the ones who go to the auctions and pay 10ís of thousands on raffle tags not the kids whoís parents pay $3 to get them an early start.

Offline jackelope

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #23 on: April 27, 2018, 03:17:44 PM »
I don't have a strong opinion about it either way, but permits are a zero sum game: when one person gets a permit, it's one less for others to get.

There are plenty of individuals who have been applying for nearly 25 years and are approaching an age where they may be able to hunt much longer. If I had a choice, I would prefer to see them have better odds to get rare permits before they can no longer hunt. :twocents:

screw the future of hunting for the opportunity of the entitled.

The entitled ones are the ones who go to the auctions and pay 10’s of thousands on raffle tags not the kids who’s parents pay $3 to get them an early start.

You mean the ones who worked their butts off to make the money to buy those auction tags? Not sure how that's "entitled".
:fire.:

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My posts, opinions and statements do not represent those of this forum

Offline X-Force

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #24 on: April 27, 2018, 03:24:13 PM »
I don't have a strong opinion about it either way, but permits are a zero sum game: when one person gets a permit, it's one less for others to get.

There are plenty of individuals who have been applying for nearly 25 years and are approaching an age where they may be able to hunt much longer. If I had a choice, I would prefer to see them have better odds to get rare permits before they can no longer hunt. :twocents:

screw the future of hunting for the opportunity of the entitled.

The entitled ones are the ones who go to the auctions and pay 10ís of thousands on raffle tags not the kids whoís parents pay $3 to get them an early start.

You mean the ones who worked their butts off to make the money to buy those auction tags? Not sure how that's "entitled".

Im all for people working their butts off and buying an auction tag.

I am all for people winning raffle tags.

I am not for people assuming because they have put in more years that they are entitled to a very limited amount of permits over everyone else.
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Offline treefarmer

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #25 on: April 27, 2018, 03:48:00 PM »
I guess I feel anything that sparks the next generation to be interested in hunting is a good thing.  My kid has three points in the OIL draws which even if he could continues to purchase he would still be 20 or so points behind someone max Points.   Personally Itís more important to me for hunting and outdoor activityís to continue.  If that hurts my chance of drawing a OIL tag thatís a small price to pay    I donít think a lot of people realize how many kids and young adults get discouraged and drop
Out after a few years.  Also didnít think it was some secret loophole as most everyone I know knew about it     


Put down your phone and go outside 

Offline bobcat

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #26 on: April 27, 2018, 04:14:07 PM »
You know what's going to affect young hunters much more than not buying points before passing hunter education? The change of youth moose tags from 18 to only 1 this year. I've been buying points for my daughters, who are now 10 and 12 years old. They each have 8 points. Now, not that it wasn't a difficult draw before, but with only 1 tag available, the 8 points I bought for them I feel was a total waste of money.

Offline dscubame

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #27 on: April 27, 2018, 04:21:14 PM »
You know what's going to affect young hunters much more than not buying points before passing hunter education? The change of youth moose tags from 18 to only 1 this year. I've been buying points for my daughters, who are now 10 and 12 years old. They each have 8 points. Now, not that it wasn't a difficult draw before, but with only 1 tag available, the 8 points I bought for them I feel was a total waste of money.

One moose tag available?  Holy smokes.
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Offline jackelope

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #28 on: April 27, 2018, 04:31:57 PM »
You know what's going to affect young hunters much more than not buying points before passing hunter education? The change of youth moose tags from 18 to only 1 this year. I've been buying points for my daughters, who are now 10 and 12 years old. They each have 8 points. Now, not that it wasn't a difficult draw before, but with only 1 tag available, the 8 points I bought for them I feel was a total waste of money.

I completely understand the frustration there, but with all that is going on with the moose populations in the northeast, they had to do something. 18 to 1 seems a little excessive though...not gonna deny that.
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" In today's instant gratification society, more and more pressure revolves around success and the measurement of one's prowess as a hunter by inches on a score chart or field photos produced on social media. Don't fall into the trap. Hunting is-and always will be- about the hunt, the adventure, the views, and time spent with close friends and family. " Ryan Hatfield

My posts, opinions and statements do not represent those of this forum

Offline jackelope

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Re: Permit changes - youth without hunters ed can no longer build points
« Reply #29 on: April 27, 2018, 04:45:31 PM »
I don't have a strong opinion about it either way, but permits are a zero sum game: when one person gets a permit, it's one less for others to get.

There are plenty of individuals who have been applying for nearly 25 years and are approaching an age where they may be able to hunt much longer. If I had a choice, I would prefer to see them have better odds to get rare permits before they can no longer hunt. :twocents:

screw the future of hunting for the opportunity of the entitled.

The entitled ones are the ones who go to the auctions and pay 10’s of thousands on raffle tags not the kids who’s parents pay $3 to get them an early start.

You mean the ones who worked their butts off to make the money to buy those auction tags? Not sure how that's "entitled".

Im all for people working their butts off and buying an auction tag.

I am all for people winning raffle tags.

I am not for people assuming because they have put in more years that they are entitled to a very limited amount of permits over everyone else.

This may or may not sound greedy(I will preface this by saying this is the first year I have ever had double digit points in anything) but I do think people who have been applying longer should have the ability to more consistently draw these permits than others with less years of trying.
:fire.:

" In today's instant gratification society, more and more pressure revolves around success and the measurement of one's prowess as a hunter by inches on a score chart or field photos produced on social media. Don't fall into the trap. Hunting is-and always will be- about the hunt, the adventure, the views, and time spent with close friends and family. " Ryan Hatfield

My posts, opinions and statements do not represent those of this forum

 

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