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Author Topic: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging  (Read 5489 times)

Offline bigtex

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New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« on: January 16, 2025, 04:29:34 PM »
New WA lands commissioner orders pause on logging sales for some older forests

Dave Upthegrove announced the move shortly after being sworn into office. It’s in line with a pledge he made during his campaign last year.

By: Bill Lucia - January 16, 2025 12:55 pm

On his first day in office, Dave Upthegrove, the state’s new public lands commissioner, said he would pause logging sales in some older state-managed forests for about six months.

In doing so, he’s taking a step toward fulfilling a campaign promise to preserve nearly 80,000 acres of older, but not necessarily old-growth, trees. How much acreage the pause would cover was not immediately clear, but a Department of Natural Resources spokesperson said Wednesday it would involve slightly more than 20 timber sales.

Upthegrove announced the pause on sales of “certain structurally complex mature forests” shortly after being sworn into office, during remarks to Department of Natural Resources staff. 

“During this pause, we’ll deploy cutting-edge technology to better identify and map the characteristics of the forests under our care,” Upthegrove said in his speech, delivered in the lobby of the department’s headquarters in Olympia. “We also will establish criteria for which structurally complex mature forests will help us meet our long-term habitat goals.”

“As someone who has worked for many years as a high school basketball referee, I know when a time-out is needed. And that’s what this is, a time out,” he added. “This process will be inclusive and transparent.”

Growing conflict 

Critics of harvesting older state forests have become increasingly vocal in recent years. They say these forests are dwindling yet are critical for the environment. And they question whether the state is meeting its goals for keeping older forests on public land intact. The trees in question do not qualify for old-growth protections but are in many cases about a century old. 

“Commissioner Upthegrove is taking immediate action to resolve a persistent, intractable issue,” Rachel Baker, forest director for Washington Conservation Action, said in a statement.

“He’s making sure the action is science based and well planned. This allows DNR to strike the right balance between public values and timber harvest, and between meeting commitments to agency policy and climate change, and commitments to communities,” Baker added.

The logging and forest products industry is against removing the forestland from the state’s timber sale rotation and says it would hurt lumber mills, jobs, and government revenue and that it shifts the goalposts on past conservation plans. They also argue that certain specialty products — like utility poles and some engineered wood — require older trees to make.

“We’re curious to learn more about his announced plan to pause some timber sales, while still delivering essential revenues to our schools, hospitals, and other local services that depend on DNR’s success,” Travis Joseph, president of the American Forest Resource Council, an industry group, said in a statement.

Another piece of the debate, which Joseph alluded to, is that revenue from timber sales goes to support schools and services provided by county governments. A state operating budget deficit estimated to be around $12 billion or more over the next four years could put Upthegrove under pressure to avoid too much of a financial dent in his agency by setting aside lands slated for logging.

Altogether, the agency manages nearly 6 million acres of public land, including about 3 million acres of state “trust lands” that produce revenue — mostly from logging. Timber sale income for the department totaled about $209 million in fiscal year 2023 and the department’s total revenue that year was around $474 million. The state’s overall operating budget is around $70 billion.

Predecessor’s perspective

The state’s previous lands commissioner, Hilary Franz, during an interview last fall, pointed to hundreds of thousands of acres the department has already set aside for conservation and highlighted the environmental benefits of using wood from trees grown in-state, rather than importing it from other places that might have less stringent logging regulations.

She also argued that the state’s forest management practices, like letting trees grow longer before cutting, leaving larger buffers along rivers, and growing multiple species for biodiversity, led to some of the forests that environmental groups now want to protect. 

“We’re being told, because you moved to all these higher standards, which the environmentalists have asked us to move to, we’re now being told: ‘don’t cut them’,” she said. 

Franz warned of cascading effects if too much logging land is preserved, with mill closures leaving fewer places to process lumber and private forest owners selling land to developers.

“I think the Evergreen State is in a significant moment of trying to figure out what its true identity is, and responsibility, in the face of climate change around our forests,” Franz said. 

She described, “a sense of confusion around the importance of us growing our forests here for multiple functions and benefits, that not all forests are the same, that we should be growing our wood products and stimulating the use of our wood products versus steel and concrete.”

https://washingtonstatestandard.com/2025/01/16/new-wa-lands-commissioner-orders-pause-on-logging-sales-for-some-older-forests/

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Offline Buckhunter24

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2025, 05:04:16 PM »
We were a handful of votes away from avoiding this.

Offline Rainier10

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2025, 05:54:57 PM »
12 billion dollar shortfall before the pause. Every penny counts and this is just more proff that they do want to increase taxes.
Pain is temporary, achieving the goal is worth it.

I didn't say it would be easy, I said it would be worth it.

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Offline Tbar

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2025, 05:58:42 PM »
Not enough lsr in region 6 I guess.....

Offline hughjorgan

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2025, 06:15:34 PM »
Log it or it’s going to burn

Offline HntnFsh

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2025, 06:53:24 PM »
Log it or it’s going to burn

They want it to burn.
Climate fire you know!

Offline bigtex

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2025, 07:18:27 PM »
Log it or it’s going to burn
Not many wildfires in western WA where most DNR timber is

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2025, 07:33:16 PM »
Commiefornia here we come!!

Don't look now but the D's have one goal, bankrupt the state worse then it is!!

They believe business's have unlimited pocket books! :bash:

Some Clown wants to limit where CCP holder can't carry, 5300+ more places,  it will take only 6.8 million dollars to implement the program!!  Ca ching!

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Offline Humptulips

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #8 on: January 16, 2025, 07:39:34 PM »
This move seems to encourage shorter rotation of cutting stands. Makes for a mentality of cut it or lose it. In the end it might have the opposite effect of creating more diverse forests.
Bruce Vandervort

Offline treefarmer

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2025, 08:17:18 PM »
This is exactly what it will encourage. The fear of this insanity moving into the private sector along with possibility of large log mills closing down. I know several small landowners that are considering harvesting their older timber sooner then later.   

Offline Born2late

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2025, 08:27:08 PM »
Log it or it’s going to burn
Not many wildfires in western WA where most DNR timber is

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True, but ripe timber is like a fruit tree, it’s ripe to cut or it rots and blows over. Our hunting area where we hunt blacktails has been devastated by all the blowdown. So much so there are huge hillsides of old growth that’s is laying down like someone cut the whole hillside. It will all rot on the ground for the next 100 years and go to waste.

Offline logger

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #11 on: January 18, 2025, 12:30:28 PM »
The dnr is a fire agency that dables in forestry anymore, the leaf lickers wanted a longer rotation, big out cry in the 80's and they got it, some mills took advantage of that and tooled up for a bigger log and qaulity market away from the standard home depot 2by 4 market, and now they use exactly what they asked for against us! I feel like this is going to open up a huge market share for canada while this state goes down in flames.
go ahead on er.

Offline MADMAX

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #12 on: January 18, 2025, 01:12:01 PM »
Wait till someone comes to the realization, the California is gonna need a lot of lumber to rebuild a lot of houses and this state could come out of its deficit real fast if they know what the hell they’re doing, which we all know, isn’t happening
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Offline Rainier10

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #13 on: January 18, 2025, 02:03:17 PM »
Wait till someone comes to the realization, the California is gonna need a lot of lumber to rebuild a lot of houses and this state could come out of its deficit real fast if they know what the hell they’re doing, which we all know, isn’t happening
This is exactly what I was thinking.
Pain is temporary, achieving the goal is worth it.

I didn't say it would be easy, I said it would be worth it.

Every father should remember that one day his children will follow his example instead of his advice.


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Offline MADMAX

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #14 on: January 18, 2025, 02:21:06 PM »
Wait till someone comes to the realization, the California is gonna need a lot of lumber to rebuild a lot of houses and this state could come out of its deficit real fast if they know what the hell they’re doing, which we all know, isn’t happening
This is exactly what I was thinking.
Right ?
A friggin win-win
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Offline Westside88

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #15 on: January 18, 2025, 03:56:55 PM »
School districts (and others) who count on timber revenue for funding should take him to court. We have lots of forest service and state parks that are being neglected as it is. DNR lands are intended to be logged in a sustainable harvest manner. Of everyone who ran he was my last choice

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #16 on: January 18, 2025, 05:24:59 PM »
School districts (and others) who count on timber revenue for funding should take him to court. We have lots of forest service and state parks that are being neglected as it is. DNR lands are intended to be logged in a sustainable harvest manner. Of everyone who ran he was my last choice
:yeah:
It'll be really interesting when it comes to funding and McCleary. The state has continually fallen short especially in the rural districts that depend heavily on DNR harvest.  Robbing Peter to pay paul with the calculator strained resources and put even more need to harvest the older stands.  Again It'll be elected blaming elected one blaming McCleary and the other blaming failing the trust.  In the end some enviros will be happy and the kids will pay the price.

Offline Birdguy

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #17 on: January 18, 2025, 06:53:19 PM »
Log it or it’s going to burn
Not many wildfires in western WA where most DNR timber is

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Tell that to all the people in Western WA who have had homeowners' insurance double or more, or worse canceled all together because they now live in "high fire danger" areas! It's happening all over after the last two summers! The desire to promote the "climate change" narrative is hurting thousands.

Offline HUNTIN4SIX

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #18 on: January 19, 2025, 06:03:46 AM »
Log it or it’s going to burn
Not many wildfires in western WA where most DNR timber is

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Tell that to all the people in Western WA who have had homeowners' insurance double or more, or worse canceled all together because they now live in "high fire danger" areas! It's happening all over after the last two summers! The desire to promote the "climate change" narrative is hurting thousands.

Those are dots few seem to connect...Good point!

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #19 on: January 19, 2025, 08:09:59 AM »
Being a sportsball referee does not make a person qualified manage forests. I worked for many years as an audio engineer and I know when people need to be muted. What does that make me qualified for?


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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #20 on: January 19, 2025, 08:32:22 AM »
Being a sportsball referee does not make a person qualified manage forests. I worked for many years as an audio engineer and I know when people need to be muted. What does that make me qualified for?


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Offline Tbar

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #21 on: January 19, 2025, 08:44:32 AM »
Log it or it’s going to burn
Not many wildfires in western WA where most DNR timber is

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Tell that to all the people in Western WA who have had homeowners' insurance double or more, or worse canceled all together because they now live in "high fire danger" areas! It's happening all over after the last two summers! The desire to promote the "climate change" narrative is hurting thousands.
@Birdguy I believe this is not based on a climate change narrative but on the wui zone done by usfa, some of those are probably in western WA. This is happening nationally by insurance companies.  On the flip side the fire scientists have been incredibly accurate on risk assessment and recognition of mismanagement, climate change as well as continuing human encroachment.  Fema needs to step in and provide fire insurance as society continues to ignore risks.

Offline Buckhunter24

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #22 on: January 19, 2025, 09:45:33 AM »
Wait until they start justifying taxes to maintain roads that lead to the local yuppy trailhead. Roads that would have been well maintained as part of a road package in a nearby timber sale that produced revenue for the public schools. The same roads used by firefighters for fighting fire. Its almost like a bunch of people learned how to manage forests through experience and schooling and built a large infrastructure that is used for many different purposes while sustainably producing revenue. These are roads that would have never existed if it weren't for forest management.

Offline Tbar

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #23 on: January 19, 2025, 10:12:46 AM »
Wait until they start justifying taxes to maintain roads that lead to the local yuppy trailhead. Roads that would have been well maintained as part of a road package in a nearby timber sale that produced revenue for the public schools. The same roads used by firefighters for fighting fire. Its almost like a bunch of people learned how to manage forests through experience and schooling and built a large infrastructure that is used for many different purposes while sustainably producing revenue. These are roads that would have never existed if it weren't for forest management.
This has been happening for two decades in whatcom county,  while education dollars continue to come up short.  DNR  has little to say when a county wants to do this depending on type of land they are managing. 

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #24 on: January 19, 2025, 11:32:54 AM »
Log it or it’s going to burn
I agree

I promise ya,mill pays bottom dollars on burnt logs.
They love burnt logs,they make a killing.

Offline bearpaw

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #25 on: January 19, 2025, 12:19:35 PM »
He is such a good Democrat!  :bash:
Americans are systematically advocating, legislating, and voting away each others rights. Support all user groups & quit losing opportunity!

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #26 on: January 19, 2025, 12:58:52 PM »
Wait until they start justifying taxes to maintain roads that lead to the local yuppy trailhead. Roads that would have been well maintained as part of a road package in a nearby timber sale that produced revenue for the public schools. The same roads used by firefighters for fighting fire. Its almost like a bunch of people learned how to manage forests through experience and schooling and built a large infrastructure that is used for many different purposes while sustainably producing revenue. These are roads that would have never existed if it weren't for forest management.
This has been happening for two decades in whatcom county,  while education dollars continue to come up short.  DNR  has little to say when a county wants to do this depending on type of land they are managing.

I'm talking specifically about the road package that is included in each sale. The work is done by the purchaser, it's often extensive and usually includes a lot of maintenance all the way out to the pavement. Without the sale, that work disappears.

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #27 on: January 19, 2025, 04:42:14 PM »
Wait until they start justifying taxes to maintain roads that lead to the local yuppy trailhead. Roads that would have been well maintained as part of a road package in a nearby timber sale that produced revenue for the public schools. The same roads used by firefighters for fighting fire. Its almost like a bunch of people learned how to manage forests through experience and schooling and built a large infrastructure that is used for many different purposes while sustainably producing revenue. These are roads that would have never existed if it weren't for forest management.
This has been happening for two decades in whatcom county,  while education dollars continue to come up short.  DNR  has little to say when a county wants to do this depending on type of land they are managing.

I'm talking specifically about the road package that is included in each sale. The work is done by the purchaser, it's often extensive and usually includes a lot of maintenance all the way out to the pavement. Without the sale, that work disappears.
Not disagreeing but when it's happening by the 1000s of acres it discounts the impact of promotion of developing more late successional as proposed by the current commissioner.

Offline fireweed

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #28 on: January 22, 2025, 11:36:20 AM »
This group is behind all of this.  They brag about suing the DNR.
https://www.wlfdc.org/
They basically are suing for every sale that is in the pipe.  I've seen some of these sales personally.  Its just typical DNR 2nd growth!  Of the 100 acre sale only about half is actually being logged, but they still claim it is all clearcut.  All the creeks have big buffers and any left-over old growth is protected, even single trees.  But they post pictures of (protected) old trees then scream clearcut.  This policy is ultimately bad for the environment long term and the species that prefer older forests, as their lawsuits/policies force the DNR and private timberland all into a 40 year rotation.  Companies like Port Blakely (that grow 60+ wood) will switch to a short rotation since all the mills that saw bigger wood will have to close. 

And right now, each bidder on these public sales is reducing their bid prices because they have to include a huge new cost: LAWYERS.  That's less money to counties/schools right off the top and it is already happening.

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #29 on: January 22, 2025, 03:48:31 PM »
This group is behind all of this.  They brag about suing the DNR.
https://www.wlfdc.org/
They basically are suing for every sale that is in the pipe.  I've seen some of these sales personally.  Its just typical DNR 2nd growth!  Of the 100 acre sale only about half is actually being logged, but they still claim it is all clearcut.  All the creeks have big buffers and any left-over old growth is protected, even single trees.  But they post pictures of (protected) old trees then scream clearcut.  This policy is ultimately bad for the environment long term and the species that prefer older forests, as their lawsuits/policies force the DNR and private timberland all into a 40 year rotation.  Companies like Port Blakely (that grow 60+ wood) will switch to a short rotation since all the mills that saw bigger wood will have to close. 

And right now, each bidder on these public sales is reducing their bid prices because they have to include a huge new cost: LAWYERS.  That's less money to counties/schools right off the top and it is already happening.
about as spot on as you can get!
go ahead on er.

Offline timberfaller

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #30 on: January 22, 2025, 05:36:20 PM »
The SAME Clowns who elected this Clown, brought to you the, LA Clown Show!!!    Get Prepared!!

Mis-management = Catastrophic Wildfires! = bigger paychecks
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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #31 on: January 22, 2025, 08:11:50 PM »
I belive it's up to 23 sales now that will be pulled during this 6 month pause,,, probably more to come.  This represents about 80 mmbf of timber. The immediate impact will be the ARRF fees that are usualy collected day of sale. (Access Road Revolving Fund)
Life member: Washington Wild Sheep Foundation & NRA

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Re: New DNR Public Lands Commissioner Halts Some State Land Logging
« Reply #32 on: January 23, 2025, 07:11:55 AM »
The SAME Clowns who elected this Clown, brought to you the, LA Clown Show!!!    Get Prepared!!

Mis-management = Catastrophic Wildfires! = bigger paychecks

This is disrespectful to clowns and this guy is not that smart so let’s call it a chit show. :stup:
I have Man Chit to do

 


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