Feedback from guys who know what they are doing :)

[WA hunter14]

can you call bears out into clear cuts or roads or will they stay along the edges?

[CAMPMEAT]

can you call bears out into clear cuts or roads or will they stay along the edges?

The ones I've called in have come from ravines and clearcuts onto the road to within 12-15 feet from me and 50 yards.

[JackOfAllTrades]

Observation is key. Even if you see a bear a 1000yds and know you can't get to him, WATCH him.
I watched a bear in the Pasayten a few weeks ago move up 1,000' of elevation eating grass in about 2 hours. Not a care in the world. Hot sun lit sparsely tree'd meadow. Watch for how often he brings his nose up to sniff the air or just take a seat and look, sniff, and listen.
Their vision does suck, but they will look around once in a while. I prefer larger open spaces than just where I can see 75yds. I glass more than I call. I seldom cold call. I like a spot where sneeking in behind me is virtually impossible but also where the wind won't give me away. Become the bruiser Blacktail buck that sits on the point, with exits down straight, left or right. (the perfect place on the knob for him is to also be able to exit back/behind) But you don't want that when calling alone. Set up where nothing can sneek up on you. As was said, find the food. If you're finding berries in their scat, find the berries. Grass.. Same thing. I wish I had a wounded Grouse call! So often that I find feathers in bear scat is unreal! Remember too that bears feed at night. If you're seeing sign but no bears, find a bedding area and call closer to that.

Salmonberries are earlier than Blackberries, then Blueberries in the high country come in later. Cabbage, grasses, grubs, mushrooms, termites, bark, Cascara at recuring times of the feeding season. They are omnivores and as you will find one occasionally traveling the river bed for spawned salmon, you won't see blackies in the water snagging salmon on the way to the fish hatchery. Yote dens, areas with bunnies, and deer areas are great, but a rabbit in distress call isn't as effective in an area where you can't trip into a bunny hole.

You mentioned 'river', so I'll point out that there are elk on every fork of the Nooksack at given times of the year. Yes, occasionally on the north side of the north fork. So a calf call could still be effective in those area's at the right time.

Yes, the average hunter doesn't get more than a half mile from his truck! But, those that do that are frequenting an area beyond 'your valley', might know something you don't. Hunting bears in the river or low country to me is like hunting Blacktail in the bush. But there are some there.  You're away for archery deer. Will you return to 'your valley', hunt down by the river, or move up to find where the blueberry fields are flourishing in mid September, (where the better tasting and better coated bears are -just my oppinion..), where you can glass from ridge to ridge to 'spot, stalk, and can call them in once you've sighted them?

-Steve

[Heetor]

Thanks for the pointers Steve this helps a lot.  Opening weekend of blacktail was great, took two guys with me that had never got a deer before and both of them got does, pretty exciting weekend for them and I think they will be new members of the hunting fold.  I had a pretty nice 2 1/2 year old with a small 4x4 rack at 25 yards, he will be a beauty in 2 years.  Wasn't an opening weekend shooter, would have been at the end of the season.  Elk  on the coast this weekend, so I guess I have some decisions to make for bear the weekend after.

Good pointer on observation too, mistake I made last year a couple of times.  I was watching bear at 600 to 700 yards down in the valley, but I never tried calling to them to see how they would react.  I kind of assumed since I was new to the call I would have more of a chance of scaring them away then bringing them in, and with them only being 300 - 400 yards out of my rifle range I thought it was best to wait and see if I would get lucky and they would work their way towards me.  Kind of lost a couple of chances to get a little practice calling and watching some live bears react.

Heading to the valley next time out is a bit of a stumper for me, just not sure.  I have limited options as I have only had a little of over a summer to scout since I moved here, and really it took me half that time to find a good area to start with.  It comes down to a choice of three places.  A thick wooded area of maybe 50 acres off of the river, but it will probably have guys in it, a more remote hike in place with a large stream and heavy bush and cover (much cooler), but a relatively small clearing, or the valley again.

The valley is where I have consistently seen bear and there is a fair bit of older scat up there on the top.  The valley is really two massive clear cuts on either side of the ridge/plateau at the top of the mountain, so I can glass for a mile.  The other two spots I have not seen much scat in the summer, and frankly didn't know to look for any other signs. 

So a bit of a gamble, but I am leaning towards the valley, it is by far the highest elevation, not sure how old the scat is as it all seems to be dried out, wish I had found some fresh stuff to make this an easier decision.  Between my last two trips up there there were some freshly torn up stumps, and a couple of spots with older clawed and chewed trees about 3/4 of the way up the trail.  I haven't gotten into the valley itself yet, steep walls and piles of old logs and bush around the rim, so there may be good sign only a couple of hundred yards away. 

I also had a bear sneak up on me opening weekend when I was calling about 3/4 of the way up the mountain, near the older clawed trees, so there is at least one in the general area.  It all seems to point to their being bear in the general area, but I haven't found any berries, and no fresh scat on the ridge or plateau, but plenty of older stuff.  Sounds to me like I am in the right area, but not necessarily in the right spot or at the right time, knowing a little more about what to look for the next trip out might help get a little closer.

Maybe it is the blueberries, there were a lot more bears in there when I found the spot late in the fall, either because they were feeding more so I was seeing them at that time of year, or maybe the higher elevation blueberries were out.  My thought for my next trip out is to head to the spot with the stream and small clearing that I haven't been to since the summer, the one back in the bush, and take a hard look for berries and other sign that may be a little fresher.  If it doesn't look promising I can head out and start working my way up the mountain again and work the valley to see what I can find.  At least I can glass the area pretty well from the ridge, which is better than wondering what is in the bush outside of a 75 yard clearing.  I'm going to also scout a little wider to see if I can find berries or some fresher sign up there.

Might try a little spot and stalking if I can glass something out in the valley, I brought a harness in case I had to go into the valley to haul quarters out.  I could climb down and then have access to the entire clear cut, but I have been hesitant to go down in there as I will make a lot of noise getting in, and I would have to leave most of my gear up top.  It would probably be nice to have an up close look at the sign in the clearing instead of watching through binos from the ridge.



 

[Carl]

Tag.  Great discussion/tips.  Thanks to all.

I haven't hunted bear yet, but now I’m feeling like I MIGHT     have a clue when I do.   

Carl

[JackOfAllTrades]

Find the food. Bears are nomadic and will wander quite a bit. Grasses on north facing slopes are lucuios but grasses on south slopes are drying out, -even on the west side...  Blackberries are still holding strong on west or south facing slopes or unshaded flats. Find a big patch of them and you're sure to find trails and tunnels in them. There are spots of blueberries doing quite well right now. The 'flying bug' hatch is over, so time in the woods gets better the closer we get to some colder weather. Keep that bear call near the elk bugle. You never know what you might see while elk hunting.
 
-Steve

[h20hunter]

Here is an observation on berries from my last trip. I'm seeing a lot of the berries that are exposed and in big clumps beginning to end the cycle. Lots of ripe berries to feed on but what is there is ripe. However, I've seen a lot of small pockets that are a bit more concealed that are just now really coming on. We heard a bear last weekend in the timber and I believe it was out and feeding in these little pockets.

[Machias]

I have been lucky enough to call in 15 bears so far over the past decade or so.  One of my favorite calls for a long time was a javelina call....that's right a javelina call.  Last I checked WA doesn't have any of the ornery little guys running around in the woods.  So why was it effective, my opinion, for a couple of reasons, it was LOUD and RASPY.  I put lots of emotions into the calling, I called non-stop for at least an hour.  But I think one of the reasons it worked so well for me was I called a bear in the third time I used it so I had confidence in it.  I think that is important.  I like to put a watch out in front of me because believe me, calling non-stop for an hour seems alot longer.  I never try to call them out into the open, never had much luck doing that.  Three of the bears I have shot were less than 15 yards when called in.  I like electronic calls, if I can get the volume loud enough, usually I can really crank on a mouth call and end up going with them.  I really enjoy the calls bearmanric and Rainshadow make and those are my go to calls now.  Biggest thing is find fresh bear sign, get in some cover and call.  Keep at it, it does and will work.

[j_h_nimrod]

I am new to this state and forum but have a bit of experience otherwise.  Most of my experience is with coastal brownies and blackies but a lot of the experience carries over. I have never called for bear purposely so can weigh nothing on that.  Below are a few thoughts.

Camo-while not useless it is overrated for bears, I have stood within 15yds of both bear species and as long as the wind was right they never saw me. Usually when they do see you at close range and not smell you they will hang around to try and figure out what you are.

Smell-very important but not a lot you can do about it.  Your best bet is just being mindful of it. You can't "eliminate" your scent, it is impossible to do for an animal that smells in the parts per million levels. You can cover and partly mask your scent with something (red fox urine on the boots mentioned) but at best it is like a set of mediocre earplugs for your hearing, does something but not much. Down here where there are literally tens of thousands of people in the woods any given week I don't feel it is quite as important as up north where there may only be a handfull of humans in an area any given year. On Kuiu Island I saw a black bear go from unconcerned eating of a rotten salmon to instantaneous full flight at a slight wind change.  The other day in the eastern part of WA I had one try and briefly check me out amid swirling, back and forth winds on a logging road.

Time and Place-Mid day you might as well take a nap cause the bears are. Mornings are hit and miss. Evenings are by far the most productive. Try hunting shaded hillsides a bit earlier in the day and watch big timber with water in the heat of the day.

My .02 anyway.

[saylean]

well said JH Nimrod. Couldnt have said it better myself about the time of day....

[bearpaw]

We have shot bear most any hour of the day, but the first 3 hours of morning and the last hour of evening have been the most productive for us. The days are long during Aug-Sept bear season, if you need a nap or break, do it from noon to 5pm, during the heat of the day, that is definitely the least active time. Hunt food sources, if there is no food, there will be no bear. Practice shooting your gun and only shoot when you know you will put the bullet into the vitals. Try for the vitals and a shoulder and don't shoot too long of range for your gun or your shooting ability or all you will do is wound or scare bear away. I like catridges with good powder capacity, high velocity, quality bullets, and sighted dead on at 200 yards. Even with the magnums we rarely shoot past 250 yards as most hunters are not effective on bear past that range and it's probably too far for some. If you will be hunting in long range areas, practice at 200 yards whenever you get a chance before you go hunting. Take shooting sticks when you hunt or have a bipod on your gun. Clothing can be any color but tans, browns, and black, don't take any chances with those colors. Pay attention to the wind, I agree with the others that you cannot beat a bear's nose, you have to keep the wind in your favor. Be quiet, bear are super sensitive to noise and will simply stay out of sight if they hear anything that doesn't belong.

When you cannot find them, think like them, if I was a bear given all the current circumstances, where would I be?

 

[Heetor]

Yeah you weren't kidding Jackofalltrades, I wish I had read your post about keeping my bear call handy when I was elk hunting.  I left it at home, and I might have gotten a shot if I had it handy, (or if I had had a rifle with me). 

Elk hunting was long and grueling, but I got a nice cow, so it was well worth the work, (picture on the link below).

http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,105137.0.html

Spending four days in the bush down in the bear river area I got to see a lot of bear and bear sign.  Saw one on Saturday afternoon when I was scouting for elk tracks, he was running into a hollow off of a nasty clear cut, I just saw his rear as he was tearing into the bush.  I tried wailing on an cow call for about 45 minutes, but he never came back out.

On Monday night we were setup cow calling on the edge of a swamp, and out walks a bear coming straight toward us.  He was at about 80 yards when I saw him, really nice bear.  I was hunkered down behind a big fallen tree trunk and the wind was right,  I nocked an arrow and thought I would have a shot if he came within 50 yards.  There was a lot of guys in the bush those days, and suddenly we could hear loud voices as someone was walking into the swamp laughing  and making a lot of noise.  The bear didn't spook but just kind of changed direction and walked back into the swamp farther up the tree line and disappeared.  Not in a hurry but a slow lumber, I wailed on the cow call for about 10 minutes but never saw him again.

Later that night after we walked out, (we left early because of the noisy hunters), I was putting my gear int he truck when about 100 yards up the road a smaller bear come squirting across the road into the trees on the opposite side of the road, and into a tunnel in the black berries.  I crept up and around the patch of berries but never saw him again.

Anyway I got a lot better picture of what good bear sign looks like over those four days.  We stomped through and around so many cuts that had black berry patches, and there was bear hair in the thorns, and piles of scat all around and in them.  Down in the swamps I saw a lot of older chewed up trees and rotten stumps, and even more scat. 

There was more sign in 100 yards of trail down there than I have seen in two years, kind of puts it in perspective.  I have been trying to setup on a couple of spots as they showed a few piles of scat and a few berries and stumps, but seeing how heavy the bear sign was down in this area I got a lot better picture of what to look for.  Though I have been off chasing deer and elk for the last two weekends so maybe the sign has improved up in the higher country where I have been bear hunting.

I negotiated a deal with my wife to let me have one more crack at bear river before I have to spend a weekend or two at home, seeing that much bear activity I have to give it another go, I sure wish it wasn't a 6 1/2 drive from my house to get there.  I am heading out after the kids go down tonight, and I should get there an hour or so before dawn to take another crack, then I am going to make the long drive home at dark, so I can technically say I was home by Sunday  

A lot of driving for a 1 day hunt, but I think I have to give that spot another try until I can get some better scouting in closer to home.

[Heetor]

Bearpaw you bring up a good point in talking about the rifles and ranges for bear, something I have put a lot of thought in specifically for bear.

I am a bit of a gun nut and spend the off season shooting at the range and working on hand loads most weekends.  I have a few choices of rifles to use for bear, and I have struggled a little with picking the best one for this job. 270 WSM for velocity and trajectory, (but is it too small), 338 WM for a much bigger bullet but pretty much the same velocity and trajectory, or 45-70 for plain old brute force but lousy velocity and trajectory?

Reading through the forum and talking to bear hunters it seems like some guys like lighter 270's, and some guys like heavier 300 magnums, kind of a different school of thought. 

I always take my 338 win mag for bear trying to get as much power as I can in a caliber that still groups well at a reasonable distance.  I choose a heavy caliber with a hot loaded lighter bullet for bear, 185 grain barnes TSX gives me just over 3000 FPS and it groups at a couple of inches at 200 yards.  My thought is a hard controlled expansion bullet moving fast with a flat trajectory seems ideal for bear, and with this round I think I could shoot 5 inch groups in the field at 300 yards, (off of my bi-pod), but I do worry a little about penetration/expansion, as the velocity would be down to about 2200 at that distance.

Anyway it would be good to hear some other guys thoughts on caliber and range for these heavy brutes...

[j_h_nimrod]

Guns - what you shoot the best in any of the  calibers you named, they all pack more than enough punch. Your 270 WSM with a quality, controlled expansion bullet would be more than enough.

You don't need more than a .30 unless you are going after big coastal brownies. These bears down here, as a rule, are not all that big. For the most part you are looking at an animal that is smaller than a nice, mature Buck so any deer cartridge is adequate. I have been in on about 15 successful bear hunts and I always explore the ballistic performance when I can. A.338 WM shooting 250gr Woodleigh Weldcores, 225gr Trophy Bonded Bearclaws, or 250gr Sierra Gamekings will pass through Both shoulders of a 8' 600+ pound brown bear. I have yet to find a bullet in a black but know a 30-06 shooting 200gr Sierras will pass clean through quartering end to end (inside front shoulder to rear off side ham). The only time I have personally heard of a bear running far or getting away was by simple bad shooting that a .458 Lott would not have fixed. I know of two nice bears weighing ~120 and ~250 taken by a 7mm-08 and a .260 Rem respectively.

My .02 again

[RadSav]

Wow!  Saylean and billythekidrock pretty much covered your questions.  Not really anything for me to add they haven't already covered.  Great advise.

In regards to guns and black bear I vary quite from the norm.  With smart bullet choices I think any cartridge good for deer and/or elk is fine for bear.  Just remember there are two ways to shoot a bear; Break them down or turn off the lights to the boiler room.  Both are effective but not all guns deliver performance to do both. 

My 257 Roberts has taken a lot of bear over the years.  And when I've missed my spot it has broken a few down reasonably well.  But, the velocity of that gun does not lend itself well to most bonded controlled expansion bullets.  Especially at any distance.

The 300 WM will break down any black bear on the planet.  But if one chooses a bullet of controlled and delayed expansion for that purpose it might not be the best bullet for taking out the lungs and heart.  There is not a lot of fat just behind the shoulder on the average bear.  The ribs are soft and thin.  And the chest cavity is not as wide as many think.  Because of this a heavy controlled expansion bullet is often just starting to work as it is leaving the other side of a bear.  Not very ideal for shutting the lights off.

So I believe you are best served by matching your bullet to your guns velocity and energy at the distances you'll probably encounter bear.  For me that's usually between 50 and 150 yards. So you won't see me shooting fall bear with core-lokts out of my 270WSM and you won't see me shooting 180 grn Accubonds out of my 308 Win.  Be sure to match your shot to the performance of that bullet and the limitations of your chosen round.