Now that it snowed they need to lock up Watt Canyon

[Oh Mah]

They were here ad the numbers dwindled from natural causes,the tribes were a huge part in bringing them back by train.


LEWIS AND CLARK HAVE EVEN WRITTEN ABOUT THEM HERE.

What happened to history in school and when did it happen here in WA.

[Platensek-po]

I dunno man. I quit after seeing someone said slavery of Native americans was outlawed in the 1600s. I mean there is a thing called google and the internet. Didnt own them routinely?? There was a whole economy based on shipping Native slaves to the indies. I wasnt until the late 1700s that african american slaves came over in greater numbers and native american slaves were intermingled with the recently brought african slaves. If you had even 1/4th african blood you could be a slave. Of course the white slave owners were super benevolent. We all know how well slaves were treated.

[MADMAX]

Please for the love of god lock the dang gate

[Oh Mah]

https://www.historylink.org/File/5556

here they speak of the elk in WA State.

[NOCK NOCK]

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/ceded


So if the ceded lands were surrendered by the tribes, They gave them up, They were not "taken" away...

just something to think about

[idaho guy]

I dunno man. I quit after seeing someone said slavery of Native americans was outlawed in the 1600s. I mean there is a thing called google and the internet. Didnt own them routinely?? There was a whole economy based on shipping Native slaves to the indies. I wasnt until the late 1700s that african american slaves came over in greater numbers and native american slaves were intermingled with the recently brought african slaves. If you had even 1/4th african blood you could be a slave. Of course the white slave owners were super benevolent. We all know how well slaves were treated.

     

This will freak you out my undergraduate degree is in history from Montana state. I could be tracking kids history in high school  fortunately I went to grad school and have a different career. As many as one quarter of Pacific Northwest Tribe’s were slaves. Not slaves of super evil Europeans but of other tribes when Europeans first arrived. Southwestern Native American tribes “routinely “ owned African American slaves. Since you do all your research on google then google slavery and the five civilized tribes. Native Americans were made to be slaves by Europeans but also by other native tribes before and after white people  arrived. In some territory like Carolina native Americans as slaves were outlawed late 1600s but continued elsewhere. Look up Irish slavery too.Or Keep googling up stuff so you can have some more white guilt but the reality is tons of terrible stuff was done to all races by ALL races back then. We would be a greater country if we could get over it and just start being Americans. Sorry for the rant Somebody please close the gate!!

[ballpark]

I dunno man. I quit after seeing someone said slavery of Native americans was outlawed in the 1600s. I mean there is a thing called google and the internet. Didnt own them routinely?? There was a whole economy based on shipping Native slaves to the indies. I wasnt until the late 1700s that african american slaves came over in greater numbers and native american slaves were intermingled with the recently brought african slaves. If you had even 1/4th african blood you could be a slave. Of course the white slave owners were super benevolent. We all know how well slaves were treated.

     

This will freak you out my undergraduate degree is in history from Montana state. I could be tracking kids history in high school  fortunately I went to grad school and have a different career. As many as one quarter of Pacific Northwest Tribe’s were slaves. Not slaves of super evil Europeans but of other tribes when Europeans first arrived. Southwestern Native American tribes “routinely “ owned African American slaves. Since you do all your research on google then google slavery and the five civilized tribes. Native Americans were made to be slaves by Europeans but also by other native tribes before and after white people  arrived. In some territory like Carolina native Americans as slaves were outlawed late 1600s but continued elsewhere. Look up Irish slavery too.Or Keep googling up stuff so you can have some more white guilt but the reality is tons of terrible stuff was done to all races by ALL races back then. We would be a greater country if we could get over it and just start being Americans. Sorry for the rant Somebody please close the gate!!

Well said and I doubt some will do the research.   To the original post - we need to reduce motor vehicle access to some of these sensitive habitats

[Tiger01]

Close the gate

[birddogdad]

this thread made me laugh.. saving game, ethical hunting was proposed and tribal chest pounding with immediate red herrings and excuses were thrown.. terrible stance to want to "use treaties" to just be exactly what every ethical hunter complains about and not see the error in your ways. Pause and reflect on why there is such negativity toward this kind of activity.

WDFW needs to grow some and very much course correct this unethical mentality especially with predator reintro!

[ballpark]

this thread made me laugh.. saving game, ethical hunting was proposed and tribal chest pounding with immediate red herrings and excuses were thrown.. terrible stance to want to "use treaties" to just be exactly what every ethical hunter complains about and not see the error in your ways. Pause and reflect on why there is such negativity toward this kind of activity.

WDFW needs to grow some and very much course correct this unethical mentality especially with predator reintro!

Being willing to acknowledge there is a problem will never happen when you can do whatever you want, wherever you want.  The mentality of what's mine is mine and what's yours is mine all be damned seems to be the norm in our state.

[jstone]

 

[jstone]

Instead of moving on, making one better in life. It is easier to play the victim. Unfortunately this is the way society is going. Backwards
People want change and to be equal but don’t want to work together to make it happen.

[idahohuntr]

I think we all win if there is better collaboration and co-management of a shared resource.  I imagine nearly all of us have that general goal in common.

That said - there is a lot of misunderstanding and incorrect information regarding Treaties.

The liberal judges/liberal courts favoring Tribes argument...I disagree.  Look at the most recent landmark Treaty hunting case out of Wyoming - majority opinion by Gorsuch - a conservative justice, appointed by a conservative President (Trump).

"In Common With" - SCOTUS has ruled on that many times, including in the last session.  It has not been interpreted by the courts as meaning they are "allowed" to have the same rights as US citizens.  This would be silly in light of US Citizenship of Native Americans.  I don't care if any particular person agrees/disagrees with this interpretation...its very solid and the legal precedent is well established.

"Open and Unclaimed lands" - This one has not been narrowly or strictly defined by the courts; however, a few SCOTUS decisions have provided some side boards...in general, public lands not put to a use that is inconsistent with hunting/fishing are generally considered open and unclaimed.  So, secure areas, defense sites, the White House lawn...while public lands, those would not be open and unclaimed lands.  Undeveloped public lands where the general public can also hunt...almost certainly going to fall within the definition of open and unclaimed.

Now...there are some basic tenants of how Tribal treaties are interpreted by the Courts...which might provide some background as to how courts come to their decisions:
-Treaties are to be interpreted as the Indians would have understood them.  For example, in our culture "right" and "privilege" have wildly different meanings...but when interpreting Treaties courts have acknowledged Indians would not have discerned between those two words...so when a Treaty says a right of taking fish and a privilege of hunting, grazing...both are viewed as a "right".
-In acknowledgement that Treaties were negotiated in a language foreign to Tribes, gray areas/ambiguities are to be interpreted in favor of the Tribe
-Treaty rights were reserved and Tribes have always had them - they are not a grant of rights from the US
-Only Congress can abrogate treaties/treaty rights

Much more I'm forgetting...but hopefully this clarifies where we are with Treaty issues...a big deal in most western states. 

[Platensek-po]

I dunno man. I quit after seeing someone said slavery of Native americans was outlawed in the 1600s. I mean there is a thing called google and the internet. Didnt own them routinely?? There was a whole economy based on shipping Native slaves to the indies. I wasnt until the late 1700s that african american slaves came over in greater numbers and native american slaves were intermingled with the recently brought african slaves. If you had even 1/4th african blood you could be a slave. Of course the white slave owners were super benevolent. We all know how well slaves were treated.

     

This will freak you out my undergraduate degree is in history from Montana state. I could be tracking kids history in high school  fortunately I went to grad school and have a different career. As many as one quarter of Pacific Northwest Tribe’s were slaves. Not slaves of super evil Europeans but of other tribes when Europeans first arrived. Southwestern Native American tribes “routinely “ owned African American slaves. Since you do all your research on google then google slavery and the five civilized tribes. Native Americans were made to be slaves by Europeans but also by other native tribes before and after white people  arrived. In some territory like Carolina native Americans as slaves were outlawed late 1600s but continued elsewhere. Look up Irish slavery too.Or Keep googling up stuff so you can have some more white guilt but the reality is tons of terrible stuff was done to all races by ALL races back then. We would be a greater country if we could get over it and just start being Americans. Sorry for the rant Somebody please close the gate!!

I don’t recall ever saying the native Americans didn’t own slaves... I do recall you saying that white Europeans didn’t routinely own native slaves yet estimates are between 2 to 5 million native Americans sold into the European slave trade. You also stated that Native American slavery was outlawed in the 1600s. This is only time of the Carolinas aNd the practice still continues there and continued in places such as California into the 1860s. I know that others have owned slaves I was merely making a point that to request someone be 100% Native American in order to be a tribal member is seriously flawed given our nations history. I don’t have any “white guilt” but I do understand what happened in our nations history. As someone who studied history in college it would seem that you have either forgotten that information or chose to ignore it. Even you understood that in your first post you were wrong and changed what you said in the second post.

[boneaddict]

So we aren’t closing the gate because we need to get the slaves out first.....  still trying to wrap my head around this without reading 10 pages of O mah talk to himself.