Anyone have experience w/ hornaday Lever-evolution?

[fishermanjoe]

Gutpile you can be as skeptical as you want. This bullet exploded in this doe. You know when you shoot a duck and there are pellet paths through the breast with some feather and blood....well imagine that all the way through all 4 quarters and backstraps, it was like the cajun injector from hell. You can say i dont know what i am talking about and all that jazz, but if you were there you wouldn't wish that meat on your worst enemy.

oh and here is his review on cabelas.com

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"LeverEvolution in 30-30 Win failed terribly upon impact with the intended target (whitetail doe). The shot was taken at 50-60 yards broadside and what should have been a near perfect double lung shot; the impact site was textbook placed. The deer was hit but continued to sprint some two hundred yards. Upon inspection I immediately noticed that there was no exit wound. Once the field dressing was initiated it was obvious that the bullet completely disintegrated. It literally exploded inside the deer. I found no less than a dozen identifiable bullet fragments and countless fragment trails throughout most of the internal organs. It looked as though the guts had been run through a blender. Intestinal matter was transferred by the exploding bullet throughout the deer and no meat whatsoever could be salvaged. I have never witnessed a hunting round fail so dramatically as this.
I reported the incident to Hornady and they dismissed it, suggesting that I hit the paunch."

Would you recommend this product to a friend? No "

[yorketransport]

I have a question for some of the more experienced folks out there...The 45-70 round is only 325 grain, any reason not to have a hotter load than that?

The only way for Hornady to give the flatter trajectory to make those long range shots so easy was with the 325gr bullet. I don't know how hard you would have to push a 400gr bullet to get that kind of trajectory, but I bet it would be a "mild discomfort" to shoot.

Andrew

[Gutpile]

Gutpile you can be as skeptical as you want. This bullet exploded in this doe. You know when you shoot a duck and there are pellet paths through the breast with some feather and blood....well imagine that all the way through all 4 quarters and backstraps, it was like the cajun injector from hell. You can say i dont know what i am talking about and all that jazz, but if you were there you wouldn't wish that meat on your worst enemy.

oh and here is his review on cabelas.com

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"LeverEvolution in 30-30 Win failed terribly upon impact with the intended target (whitetail doe). The shot was taken at 50-60 yards broadside and what should have been a near perfect double lung shot; the impact site was textbook placed. The deer was hit but continued to sprint some two hundred yards. Upon inspection I immediately noticed that there was no exit wound. Once the field dressing was initiated it was obvious that the bullet completely disintegrated. It literally exploded inside the deer. I found no less than a dozen identifiable bullet fragments and countless fragment trails throughout most of the internal organs. It looked as though the guts had been run through a blender. Intestinal matter was transferred by the exploding bullet throughout the deer and no meat whatsoever could be salvaged. I have never witnessed a hunting round fail so dramatically as this.
I reported the incident to Hornady and they dismissed it, suggesting that I hit the paunch."

Would you recommend this product to a friend? No "

Look at all the other reviews though.      Holy cow it's clearly bs. There's no way in the world "a perfectly placed shot" would ruin every bit of meat on the animal. I'm sorry but no way. He absolutely gut shot it. No question. There's no way it liquified every organ in the deer. I'm not trying to be a dick but it's just not possible to liquify ALL of the inards and ruin ALL of the meat with one bullet.

Furthermore if this was a "textbook" lung hit and the bullet did that much damage would this deer have run 200 yards? Remember, it liquified everything. I've seen lung hit deer go a quite a ways but not 200 yards.

His discription is identical to mine except I admit I gut shot the pronghorn doe while he won't admit it. The evidence is clear to me.

That's all from me. Not trying to start a pissing contest so we'll have to agree to disagree.

[Greg4829]

but I bet it would be a "mild discomfort" to shoot.

  Ha yes...My brother offered up some buffalo bore 500 gr...After 8 rounds I was ready for a break. 

[CP]

I’m not impressed with the 30-30 Lever-evolution.  It strings horizontally out of my Marlin 336, shoots 4 MOA and the trajectory is no better than 150g core-lokt which is half the price.  I get much better performance with handloaded Sierra or Speer 150g flat nose. 

[Gutpile]

I have a question for some of the more experienced folks out there...The 45-70 round is only 325 grain, any reason not to have a hotter load than that?

The only way for Hornady to give the flatter trajectory to make those long range shots so easy was with the 325gr bullet. I don't know how hard you would have to push a 400gr bullet to get that kind of trajectory, but I bet it would be a "mild discomfort" to shoot.

Andrew

Agreed, this stuff is all about shooting flat. Thats why they chose that weight. It's still packs a pretty stout recoil though compared to other factory stuff. If I used the 45/70 more I'd probably load some up and see what I could come up with but the factory ammo is accurate in my rifle and it hits plenty hard for me. thats the only rifle I own that shoots factory ammo.

[PA BEN]

Gutpile you can be as skeptical as you want. This bullet exploded in this doe. You know when you shoot a duck and there are pellet paths through the breast with some feather and blood....well imagine that all the way through all 4 quarters and backstraps, it was like the cajun injector from hell. You can say i dont know what i am talking about and all that jazz, but if you were there you wouldn't wish that meat on your worst enemy.

oh and here is his review on cabelas.com
I love these rounds. But never shot an animal yet with them. I would like to know what grain of bullet he used that blew up this deer.

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"LeverEvolution in 30-30 Win failed terribly upon impact with the intended target (whitetail doe). The shot was taken at 50-60 yards broadside and what should have been a near perfect double lung shot; the impact site was textbook placed. The deer was hit but continued to sprint some two hundred yards. Upon inspection I immediately noticed that there was no exit wound. Once the field dressing was initiated it was obvious that the bullet completely disintegrated. It literally exploded inside the deer. I found no less than a dozen identifiable bullet fragments and countless fragment trails throughout most of the internal organs. It looked as though the guts had been run through a blender. Intestinal matter was transferred by the exploding bullet throughout the deer and no meat whatsoever could be salvaged. I have never witnessed a hunting round fail so dramatically as this.
I reported the incident to Hornady and they dismissed it, suggesting that I hit the paunch."

Would you recommend this product to a friend? No "

[fishermanjoe]

I hit a little far back (open sites) and yes it turned the guts into soup just like you described.

Gutpile please don't take this as any kind of bitching argument, I like constructive reviews of equipment. We can argue all day on where this guy hit the doe, so there is no point in arguing that, my question to you is in regards to the quote above. When you hit this pronghorn, was there an exit hole? Or was the soup due to fragmentation? Because if it did fragment with no exit hole then it failed. I may not be a ballistic expert like some of the members on here, but from what i was told and what I have read in magazines was that the job of a bullet for big game is to expand or mushroom inside of the animal while obtaining maximum weight, in short deform without breaking apart. Would you agree?

[jdb]

if you add completely penatrate i'd agree with you

[fishermanjoe]

yes, yes, completely penetrate, with a big exit hole.

[Gutpile]

I hit a little far back (open sites) and yes it turned the guts into soup just like you described.

Gutpile please don't take this as any kind of bitching argument, I like constructive reviews of equipment. We can argue all day on where this guy hit the doe, so there is no point in arguing that, my question to you is in regards to the quote above. When you hit this pronghorn, was there an exit hole? Or was the soup due to fragmentation? Because if it did fragment with no exit hole then it failed. I may not be a ballistic expert like some of the members on here, but from what i was told and what I have read in magazines was that the job of a bullet for big game is to expand or mushroom inside of the animal while obtaining maximum weight, in short deform without breaking apart. Would you agree?

Mine both penetrated all the way through. The one through the guts didn't have too big a hole.... (silver dollar sized) the finish shot passed through with a little larger exit hole.

To answer your question yes, I want total pass throughs. Some folks on the other hand do not. They want the bullet to dump all of the energy within the animal. But I do want pass throughs except on coyotes. I want that bullet to blow up inside and not exit.

[dasbear]

Dont want to get in the middle of this BUT even Standard Rifle bullets dont always exit and quite often are found on the off side under the hide. They dont have to exit in order to have performed. Next point is that Ive heard of several instances where ballistic/nylon tipped bullets have exploded and or vaporized on the surface of a animal or shortly thereafter for no predictable reason except to say that if these bullets are being shot at a high velocity and the animal is very close you will see some bullets fail do to excessive speed and even moreso if the bullet also hits a bit back of the lungs. It might be easier to determine the reason if we knew what the cartridge, caliber and velocity was in this incident.

Dasbear

[fishermanjoe]

It might be easier to determine the reason if we knew what the cartridge, caliber and velocity was in this incident.

I will get a hold of him and ask him the specifics. I think he just signed up on the site, so i will ask him what his screen name is.

Gutpile, maybe it was the range and the velocity, or maybe it was the bullet, once i get the specifics from my friend then we will get some answers.

[Gutpile]

Keep in mind, mine was a 45/70. Quite a bit bigger pill

[fishermanjoe]

ok well i do know for a fact that he was shooting a 30-30. Maybe its to hot of a round for the 30-30, and only effective at long ranges where it loses some velocity