Oh No!

[Lowedog]

If I were you guys I would just stop putting in for permit hunts.  That will show them!  Spread the word!  

Even better, quit buying any licenses or hunting in Washington PERIOD!  Show those greedy *censored*s and don't give them ONE THIN DIME.  

I salute your integrity and admire your stand on principal; I am inferior, so will keep hunting in WA, but will be deeply ashamed way down inside.

DOUBLELUNG, I too am inferior so I will keep hunting and applying in WA.  But the rest of you, Please stop applying for permit hunts or better yet stop hunting in WA all together like DOUBLELUNG said.  

You have to make a stand and show them you won't take it anymore!!!  Spread the word!!!!

[bobcat]

I guess it depends how you want to look at the figures.  I see x amount of hats with 4 names in them and I see the same amount hats with two choices or names in them.  To me that would most likely increase my odds.  Think of elk alone.  Do you put your name in the hat with one choice only (blues tag) for that monster bull, or do you put it in there, in the next blues tag, one in the clock and one in the Yakima. 

Thats exactly how I see it too bone, pretty odvious to me, less names in the hat means better draw odds! I dont see how thats hard to understand, sure some hunts wont change much and it makes people really decide what they want!

But it wouldn't be less names in the hat. The real popular permits like Desert and Entiat mule deer could possibly become much more difficult to draw if choices were reduced, as many people might then only apply for the top hunts. It's obvious to me that some permits would become easier to draw, while others became more difficult. Chaning the number of choices wouldn't necessarily make the draw "better" or more fair, it would just make it different.

[SkookumHntr]

Yes it is less names in the hat. When you see entiat 50 permits, 5000apps, the 5000 includes 3rd and 4th choice applicants. eliminate 3rd and 4th choice and the 5000 goes down, thus better draw odds. Sure people may change what is 1 and 2 but bottem line less names in the hat. I cant put it any clearer.

[bobcat]

I can't say it any clearer either. Same number of applicants overall, and the same number of permits, equals same overall odds. Some permits will be better odds, others worse.

The thing is you don't know if that 5000 number will go down. Maybe all those people will still choose Entiat as #1 choice.

[SkookumHntr]

How it is now is same # applicants times 4! Limit the choices to 2 then its that # of applicants times 2 if its 2 choices! that equals way less applicants. 

[bobcat]

You don't get it. Take a statistics course. That may help.

[SkookumHntr]

I give up. Think what ya want

[Curly]

 

[turkeydancer]

 
I can remember when you bought your $5 hunting license and you were allowed to go get a bull, a buck, etc and there were no tags or permits to buy and you hunted anywhere in the state you wanted ... and you could hunt with a bow in September, gun in Oct, muzzleloader in Nov, and bow again in Dec/Jan. And there were general either sex late seasons open for everyone to boot.
 
Then you had to start buying tags for the species you wanted to hunt, and if you also wanted to use a bow and/or muzzleloaders you had to buy a special permit to use those addition weapons.

And then they started making you choose what weapon, choose what side of the state to hunt, get special permits, etc. And if there were say 125 permits for a hunt/unit, you put in for that one hunt and only that hunt (no 2nd, 3rd, or 4th choices).  I also remember that it wasn't split 10 ways to Sunday (ie: 25 youth, 25 over 65, 25 disabled, 25 AHE, 25 regular, etc) and everyone had an equal chance each year no matter what (nor how many points you had accumulated).
 
And here's the capper ... there were lots more hunters and lots more game for those hunters.  Is WDFW making it better for us?  Do they have a clue as what to do for the hunter to improve the opportunties?   I sometimes wonder ... at least I can afford the time and money to go to other states now if I so choose.
 
Thanks WDFW !!!!

[Lowedog]

I can remember when you bought your $5 hunting license and you were allowed to go get a bull, a buck, etc and there were no tags or permits to buy and you hunted anywhere in the state you wanted ... and you could hunt with a bow in September, gun in Oct, muzzleloader in Nov, and bow again in Dec/Jan. And there were general either sex late seasons open for everyone to boot.
 
Then you had to start buying tags for the species you wanted to hunt, and if you also wanted to use a bow and/or muzzleloaders you had to buy a special permit to use those addition weapons.

And then they started making you choose what weapon, choose what side of the state to hunt, get special permits, etc. And if there were say 125 permits for a hunt/unit, you put in for that one hunt and only that hunt (no 2nd, 3rd, or 4th choices).  I also remember that it wasn't split 10 ways to Sunday (ie: 25 youth, 25 over 65, 25 disabled, 25 AHE, 25 regular, etc) and everyone had an equal chance each year no matter what (nor how many points you had accumulated).
 
And here's the capper ... there were lots more hunters and lots more game for those hunters.  Is WDFW making it better for us?  Do they have a clue as what to do for the hunter to improve the opportunties?   I sometimes wonder ... at least I can afford the time and money to go to other states now if I so choose.
 
Thanks WDFW !!!!

Wow!! You are really old!!!!!   

[turkeydancer]

I can remember when we had no other choice than to hunt with a bow (gun ? what's a gun)!  I been hunting here long enough to have moss covering my entire northside ....
 

Been hunting here since I was a wee lad (44+ years) ... 
... mostly with good success ... however long enough to see it tons better !!!

[boneaddict]

I don't understand him either Skookum.  he is saying 5,000 applicants for x amount of permits, the 5,000 including 3rd and 4th choices.  Take those away and its 2500 right there.  SOOoooooo if all 2500 of those choose the entiat, then I will be the only one applying in the Methow.  My odds increase.  The way the current system is, those same number of applicants can apply to the Entiat and the Methow AND THE DESERT. 

[boneaddict]

and for the record, I took statistics in college.

[bobcat]

But boneaddict, we don't know what people would do if they were only allowed 1 or 2 choices. It could be that if people only had 1 choice, they wouldn't apply for the Entiat, knowing it is one of the most popular mule deer permits, and maybe the majority would then only apply for your Methow permits, making your odds worse. That's all I've been saying all along, is we don't know how odds would change for each permit. Some would be better odds, some worse. But overall, odds would stay exactly the same.

[boneaddict]

Statistics would show that if you had 4 chances at choosing unit A versus one chance, then you'd be statistically 4 times likely to have a name in Hat A.

If there were a total of 15 hats and you had 4 names to put into one of those hats, statistically you'd be more likely to have a name put into one of your hats.

This is especially true if you are already seeking one unit to hunt.