High Hunt

[75johndeere]

so we are finally going to do the high hunt this year and i was wondering if anyone has recommendations on outfitters for a drop camp.  i figured the sportsman show in a few weeks will be when well book.

[carpsniperg2]

i have seen a few online but never used one myself i am sure there will be a few down there

[Ridgerunner]

I'd go with Icicle outfitters.  Lots of good camps, good country. 

[boneaddict]

Need to choose a wilderness and then go from there. 

[75johndeere]

we want to go into the Pasayten

[bobcat]

We did drop camp with Cascade Wilderness Outfitters a few years ago and had a good hunt. Here is their website:  http://www.methow.com/c_w_outfitters/index.htm

If you end up going with them, PM me and I can give you some more information. You may be able to talk to them at the Sportsman's Show in Puyallup next weekend. That's where I booked our trip.

[OU812]

Are there outfitters who do drop camps in the Glacier Peaks wilderness area?

[bobcat]

Icicle outfitters

[haugenna]

Are there outfitters who do drop camps in the Glacier Peaks wilderness area?

If you want to pay the money to do a drop camp, do it during the general season.  A LOT less people and the heat won't be such an issue.  Granted it will be cold during the general but that will also activate the deer a little more. 

 

[OU812]

Thanks for the info.. 

[WDFW-SUX]

Im kinda pissed my favorite wilderness is not included in the hunt..and I wish we could have a elk season in august in the wilderness areas.

[huntnphool]

I have spoken with these people at the shows before, they have always been honest, helpfull and seem like a good outfit. That being said I have never hunted with them but I would check them out if looking into that kind of hunt.

http://www.earlywintersoutfitting.com/

[75johndeere]

thanks for the info guys the reseon we were going to do the early hunt instead of the normal season is i would like to take my old man.  He is a straight up animal while tromping around in the woods but he has alot of metal in his left leg and the cold really messes with his knee.  For anyone who has been successful in the early hunt how do you keep the meat and hide cool for the week if the outfitter doesn't come back until the end of the hunt?

[bobcat]

It shouldn't be a problem keeping the meat cool in mid-September in the high country. Temeratures should get down into the upper 20's, low 30's at night. Hang your meat in the shade and keep it covered and it should be just fine.

[boneaddict]

Both good outfits.  I think the main difference would be what side of the Pasayten you wanted to go in on.  Steve is pretty much on the east side, and Aaron goes in up Harts Pass I believe.  The deer are about the same on either.  You should try to book them before the show circuit starts.   

[bobcat]

Yes, Boneaddict is right. Steve Darwood (Cascade Wilderness Outfitters) is on the east side of the Pasayten and that's one of the reasons I went with him. The east side is easier country and dryer than the west side. If that matters to you.

[MtnMuley]

x2 for Steve Darwood or also North Cascades Safari, if Ryan is still doing it this year.  You won't be disappointed with either.

[jackelope]

thanks for the info guys the reseon we were going to do the early hunt instead of the normal season is i would like to take my old man.  He is a straight up animal while tromping around in the woods but he has alot of metal in his left leg and the cold really messes with his knee.  For anyone who has been successful in the early hunt how do you keep the meat and hide cool for the week if the outfitter doesn't come back until the end of the hunt?

it will probably be fairly cold up there in september.

[jackelope]

thanks for the info guys the reseon we were going to do the early hunt instead of the normal season is i would like to take my old man.  He is a straight up animal while tromping around in the woods but he has alot of metal in his left leg and the cold really messes with his knee.  For anyone who has been successful in the early hunt how do you keep the meat and hide cool for the week if the outfitter doesn't come back until the end of the hunt?

it will probably be fairly cold up there in september.

I shot one last year and it took two days to get out. Both days were sunny and the meat was on my back most of the time. I think it got cool enough at night to make it through the day. The yellow jackets were trying to eat it all during the day so I had to keep moving it. It worked out, I am not dead yet from eating it.

I wasn't reffering to the meat, I mentioned it because of his dad's knee condition and it giving him problems when it's cold. my buddies have been up there the last few years and while it was nice last year, it snowed on them the 2 years prior.
 

[boneaddict]

It can be Sahara to arctic in September.  I have gone from a 90 degree day to a foot of snow overnight.  Idabooner has been in some serious crap up there and the last year I hunted it, we had to bail with the meat to prevent spoilage. 

[actionshooter]

I know I hunted in GPW a few years ago on the high hunt, sweated my butt off one day. Had to be 90, then the next morning there was 2" of snow. Be ready for anything.

[75johndeere]

great advice guys he does alright in the cold but i figured we would be better off if his leg thaws out every once in awhile.  I'm really excited about the hunt i have been trying to get my buddies to do this for the last 4 years and everyone finally commeted.  what size group did you guys go with we are at 5 right now and i don't know if i should invite anyone else?

[actionshooter]

great advice guys he does alright in the cold but i figured we would be better off if his leg thaws out every once in awhile.  I'm really excited about the hunt i have been trying to get my buddies to do this for the last 4 years and everyone finally commeted.  what size group did you guys go with we are at 5 right now and i don't know if i should invite anyone else?

We have had as many as 2 counting my self, several times I have had 1 in camp counting myself. I wouldn't do anymore than that. 

[high country]

I would not have a big group of guys. the deer are not that thick in the high hunt, more of a quality hunt. do not expect to fill a packstring full of tags.....unless you take runts too.

[75johndeere]

My dad helped pack out elk quarters 1300 vertical feet in about 1/2 mile this year his knee if fine with the packing its just the cold bothers him but hes a trooper always pushes through.  we are not expecting to fill every tag even though it would be nice myself i would most like to get a bear i have been chasing them for a few years and haven't even got close .  I'm mostly in it for the experience and 500 and change isn't all that bad to learn something new if i like it i might even hike in in 2011 or buy some horses.

[high country]

bears are deffinately better odds then multiple big bucks

[boneaddict]

Are you campin g or hunting?  A group of 5 to me is too many for hunting.  Course I like a group of one for that.  I'd uninvite about 3 of those folks and make it a father son deal.  If you plan on enjoying the scenery, sitting around camp and putting a few down then your party is about the right size.

[Skyvalhunter]

Depends on if you are talking an actual hunting camp or a B.S. session camp. More people = less odds of success.

[halflife65]

Depends on if you are talking an actual hunting camp or a B.S. session camp. More people = less odds of success.

Better to go by yourself (if you've made some plans to get an animal out and you're comfortable with that) or with one other person. 

[Dansk]

My group booked with early winters about 3 years ago - good people, good stock, experienced packers, concerned for your safety, etc. however there were enough issues that would make me not recommend them.  I know alot of people say Aaron is a stand-up guy, but they overcommited that year and a few parties including mine got the short end of the stick (other's have posted similar expereinces with them on this board besides my party).  We booked in Feb, sent in deposits, spent time on the phone with them, etc., so this should not have been an issue.

The bad:

The tent was horrible -  don't get me wrong - i'm far from picky, but this thing should've been thrown away years ago... too small for 4 guys and gear, old, torn, holes, moldy, and the flaps wouldn't close.

They did not bring us a stove for 3 days, and when they did they dumped it and left.  It was a 'ground stove' - you dig a hole and put a large metal box with a hole on top.  It was  PITA and the stack was full of holes, so we were always getting smoked out.

We requested a camp at altitude, close to the timberline when we booked, they said no problem.  However they would not tell us where they were puting our camp- even up to 2 days prior.  We wanted to plan our different hunts, buy topos, etc, but they refused to commit to telling us where.  We ended up on the middle fork valley floor on the main trail,  in the timber, about 4 miles in.  Had to hike thousands of vertical every day to get up high.

Apparently they overbooked - they had booked  quite a few parties on the same day at 7am at harts pass.  They said they would TRY to get us in that day but couldn't guarantee it so we might need to go back to twisp and come back the next day to pack in.  WTF?? Luckily they squeezed us in early evening.

Others may have good experiences with them, but almost $3000 for a few hours on horseback, a dilapidated tent, a crappy stove, poor planning, and bad customer service was far from worth it.  All our problems were due to the fact that they purposely overbooked and the last people in got screwed with spots, gear, and timeline.  The only explanation I can think of is that they took everyone's cash who asked to book and thought they'd just figure it all out later - at our expense.  That's just plain bad business in my book.

My recommendation is to get them to try and guarantee your spot and let you know where it is prior to the hunt, commit to pack in time, and specify the gear you will get.  Ask how old thier gear is, how big the tent is, what type of stove, etc, and ask them if they are overbooked.

 

[AKBowman]

 
That's why I go light and go DYI. Cant blame the outfitters for trying to get as much $$ as possible but it takes a real experienced outfitter to know thier limits as far as booking capacity. There's a fine line between overbooking and underbooking. They HAVE to get to max capacity during that time of year otherwise they dont feed their families well that year...thats why I say cant blame em.

Take the $ you were going to pay them get some good gear that will last you forever and DYI. Nothing can beat the satisfaction of completing a trip. Killing a critter is only a bonus.

[Ridgerunner]

There's a reason why certain outfitters are at the show every year trying to fill their books, not too many repeat clients, I can see why.....

[jackelope]

some outfitters who are not at the shows every year have a wierd way of advertising.

 

[CMG]

  I am not trying to defend any of the outfitters, or call anyone out, so don't read this post wrong. But may be helpful to those who may be thinking of going on a pack trip with one of the outfitters in this area.

  I have used an outfitter on the early high hunt in the Pasayten for over 15 years, going sometimes consecutive years, sometimes skipping a couple of years. I have always gone with family or good friends keeping the group to 4-5. It is an in-credable experience every time I go, and one I have never regretted! I have always utilized the "Drop camp" as it is the least expensive and provides the best nature has to offer other than hiking in yourself.
   
  unless you want to pay for the "deluxe trips" and Pay for a cook to have your food catered to you each day, or have a guide show you how to spot for animals...... here's what you should expect from a "drop camp":

    First let's define "Drop camp": The Outfitters will guarantee you will be "Dropped off" and they guarantee you will be "Picked up". There are no specific days or times, only mild mentions of "within these days". For the most part the packers stick to the plan, but there are a multitude of unforeseen things that can happen, so deal with it!


  - The packers will Manny your gear and load it on mules, they will even help you on your horse, other than that you are expected to stay on the horse! no matter how hungover you are from the night before at three finger jacks! Go ahead and grease the wheel early, a little shared snort between work with the packers makes the morning go faster, if you didn't finish the bottle off before you hit the trail, let the packer carry it for you. Just don't expect it back!

  - Prepare for the worst weather conditions possible and hope for the best, especially on the trail up and back. Sometimes it starts out sunny and 65 deg. and two miles into a twenty mile ride it turns to 10 Deg. 60 mile an Hr, winds and snowing up to two feet by the time you get there. Tip: If you don't ride a horse more than twenty times a year, bring some "Gold Bond" up for the skin you are going to be missing on your inner thighs when the ride is over. or wear bicycle pants under your jeans, or do what I do, and stash another bottle for the ride. (remember you gave the packer your bottle earlier). After a mile or so into the trip you are in the wilderness, there will be no stores, there will be no rescue efforts if you get uncomfortable. I recommend Reading the wilderness rules and regulations before you go, rescue efforts will be made only in "Life and death" situations, broken arms, legs, migraines or tummy aches, do not constitute a rescue!

  - You are finally at the drop camp! Tip: before you get off your horse, make sure you are surrounded by flat stable ground. You just spent 8 Hrs. on a horse and your knees will not work properly, they will be bent at a 45. Deg. angle for several Hrs. (Ok, maybe it was the blood alcohol level?). Now is the time to remember the Definitions of a "Drop camp". You have been dropped off! Just because there was a ground bee hive ten miles back that broke the pack string up and all of your clothes and gear are somewhere on a rogue mule between you and the four passes you just rode over, is not the packers fault. utilize what you have left and deal with it.

  - At this point, depending upon how you greased the wheel, What time you have arrived and where the rogue mules are, you may get help from the packer setting up camp. I would highly recommend though, you have basic knowledge of how to set up a wall tent and stove yourself, or a fir bough shelter as you unload the Manny's and realize your wall tent is on one of the rogue mules. Oh, I forgot to mention there has been some ongoing forrest fires in the area and the normal campsites have been "closed"  for several days and you are dropped off on a barren wind ridden ridge with the closest fire wood a 1/2 mile away. Now this is getting back to basics! As we discuss between ourselves, this trip will make some good memories! 

  - Remember the first point? Prepare for the worst, hope for the best going in and out? This helps when it is the only clothes you have for the next several days. (Except for your brothers stuff, although he is 8" shorter and 100 LBS. less). Now is when all the anticipation and dreaming for several months of a high country buck coming into the cross hairs comes to fruition. You roam out into the wilderness in search of the trophy, find your old perch and wait. As light starts to appear over the horizon you can start make out the familiar peaks and valley's, your heart racing with anticipation. You take a deep breath in to waft the high country air, but it is an unfamiliar smell, One filled with charcoal? as the sun makes it way down the tops of the ridges you realize the whole valley and hillside has been burnt to a crisp! You sit in awe, pack up, and head for your #2 hunting spot!

  - The next five days are filled with 75 deg. weather. (the snow melted the first night). the nights are brighter than the days, the deer relish in the night and completely disappear in the day! You have blisters on blisters from hiking the steeps. Not an animal to be found on this trip. You wake up the last day and pack all of the gear up ready for the packers to come at nine AM. as scheduled...Wait.....wait.....dark is upon us, No sign of the packers. Set camp back up, we'll try again tommorrow. Snow starts to fall.....Hard, wake up to over 16" of snow, figures! Pack up again and wait for the packers, finally around noon they saunter in. Have a few snorts and reminisce about the incredible hunt/time. The ride back is filled with blizzard's and empty hopes.

  - Finally arrive back at the trucks, unload the mules, pack it all away. THIS IS THE TIME TO TIP THE PACKERS! Shake their hands and thank them, They did their job, They "Drop camped" you! That is what you paid for, You make the experience what you want to. I have been to the booths at the Sportsmans shows and I have heard the promises and the tales and the saleman pitches.....Don't be naive, we are grown men with hunting experience, there are no Guarantees for anything! I wouldn't trade one trip, one experience I have had over the last 15 yrs. up in the Pasayten.
 
Hope this helps anyone who plans to take a high country packing trip.   
 

[MtnMuley]

Very good post.   I think you should name the outfitter to give him/her a little pat on the back for several years of good memories.

[CMG]

 I think you should name the outfitter to give him/her a little pat on the back for several years of good memories.
[/quote]

  MtnMuley - If anyone has been blessed to ever have had Claude Miller formerly "Blue Chip" pack them in on a high hunt they would have had an experience they would never forget! I miss those days. Many a nights stories could be filled with campfire talk about Claude.
 Since Claude has retired from packing, Ryan Surface took over W/ "North Cascade Safaris" and has been equally gratifying. It has been three years since our last trip, we are planning on going back this year, I hope Ryan is still packing, there have been rumors.

[haugenna]

Good post and it has some good points.  

I agree with a lot of what you said but there are a couple things that a good outfitter should rectify in some way if they happen.

For instance, if a rogue mule runs off with your tent and tarps then the outfitter better be up there the very next day or the same day with a tent and tarps.  You need shelter.  If it rains and all your gear is wet and the temperature plummits you could get hypothermia.  I think the hunter should pack for the worst but it is the outfitters job to prepare for the worst when it comes to his animals.

Secondly, regarding pick up and drop off.  If the packer says he is going to be there on Friday, then he better be there on Friday.  If he says Friday or Saturday then thats different.  People have jobs, families that may be worried about them, and other commitments that are ahead of the packer's agenda.  I have never done a drop camp and probably will someday in the future.  I want to know what I am paying for and if the packer is making promises then he better own up to them if he wants my referral and repeat business.

[MtnMuley]

Thanks CMG.  Good people like Claude and Ryan need to be mentioned for the great memories they've given the people over the years.  Maybe that's why they always have repeat clients.

[CMG]

  Agreed, the safety of their clients is always their biggest concern, and to the best of their ability should stick to the agenda,  and in all of the trips I have gone on, I believe this was carried out by the outfitter EXTREMELY WELL.
 I guess the point I was trying to make is: Expect the unexpected, enjoy and make the best of the unexpected situations. You are 15-24 miles into the backcountry and should be capable of making due, when unfortunate situations arise, because they do happen!  

[haugenna]

 Agreed, the safety of their clients is always their biggest concern, and to the best of their ability should stick to the agenda,  and in all of the trips I have gone on, I believe this was carried out by the outfitter EXTREMELY WELL.
 I guess the point I was trying to make is: Expect the unexpected, enjoy and make the best of the unexpected situations. You are 15-24 miles into the backcountry and should be capable of making due, when unfortunate situations arise, because they do happen!  

Well Said

[75johndeere]

has anyone used Brian Varrelman with sawtooth outfitters? 

[boneaddict]

I know him.  He has outstanding stock, and hunts in some of the best Trophy muledeer country available to man. 

CMG.  Great stuff.  I grew up and graduated with Claudes daughter, and well son I guess too. Tye is my Dads neighbor.   Great people!  I wish time didn't take its toll.  My brother used to pack for him. 

One of my favorite old rodeo pics was me riding a steer and I am about to hit the dust and Claude is standing behind me in his Redneck T-shirt, with a look on his face.  Oooooooo that is gonna hurt. LOL 

[PacificNWhunter]

Good write up CMG.

[axelfisher]

A group of Six of us used Brian with Sawtooth about 5 years ago. Seemed like a great guy.
He did what he was suppost to do. He packed us in had a good tent up and a fire pit.
The hunt was like mentioned before tough to say great unless you put in the effort.
I got a beautiful Black bear on the 5th day of the trip. It sure made my trip but no such luck for the rest of the group.

Great service to use for what you pay for...
He got us in...And He got us out...

We did help him drag a Dead horse off the trail from the ride in...Kinda a goofy story...

I would love to do it again just for the amazing experiance

Good luck

[CMG]

One of my favorite old rodeo pics was me riding a steer and I am about to hit the dust and Claude is standing behind me in his Redneck T-shirt, with a look on his face.  Oooooooo that is gonna hurt. LOL 

  Bone - I think you gave me an idea on a new thread subject "Favorite packer/outfitter stories".
  Claude's daughter helped out a few times, great gal. It has been several years (My memories melding together) but I believe she was nick named Red? We have had several great packers thru both Blue chip and North Cascade Safaris, The ones that stand out at the moment (Don't remember the last names). is Rob, who worked with Claude the longest, heard he got a job W/ the forrest service? Big'n, Name say's it all! Dan and others I can't think of their names right now.
  Sorry got lost in great memories, not trying to differ from the thread content.

[m.v.hunter]

One of my favorite old rodeo pics was me riding a steer and I am about to hit the dust and Claude is standing behind me in his Redneck T-shirt, with a look on his face.  Oooooooo that is gonna hurt. LOL 

  Bone - I think you gave me an idea on a new thread subject "Favorite packer/outfitter stories".
  Claude's daughter helped out a few times, great gal. It has been several years (My memories melding together) but I believe she was nick named Red? We have had several great packers thru both Blue chip and North Cascade Safaris, The ones that stand out at the moment (Don't remember the last names). is Rob, who worked with Claude the longest, heard he got a job W/ the forrest service? Big'n, Name say's it all! Dan and others I can't think of their names right now.
  Sorry got lost in great memories, not trying to differ from the thread content.

Not trying to change anything on your story but Red is not Claude's daughter she is from over in the Colville area and Rob did'nt get a job with the forest service ,he works for the fish and wildlife but like I said I do not want to ruin your story.

[CMG]

MV, no worries, thanks for the clarification. It has been a few years.

[JoeE]

Brian Varrelman packed me into the Pasayten for the high hunt in 2008. I would recommend him if you want to do a drop camp. The only problem I had is after we got to our drop camp we decided that we actually wanted to spend more time on the ridges, about 3000' above camp. So we packed light and camped out on the top most nights only staying in the wall tent two out of seven days. If I go back to the Pasayten I'm just going to hike in.