nile paper says muck's shot 140+/- deer last weekend?

[PlateauNDN]

Also I will take pics off the showoff indians who will be out in full force this weekend. anybody on here should take pics to get there faces on the internet as bad guys. 1 gamie had stopped some indians just west of whistlin jacks going back to the westside with elk and deer in back. .this was sunday evening/night. Us whiteguys who hunt over here are fed up with the terrible numbers. We are blaming it partly on the muckleshoots. 

I agree this is BS if the indians continue to shoot anything and everything with no rules then there will be nothing left pretty soon for anyone.  This treaty BS needs to end this is not what the treaty was suppose to do.  I watched indians driving around in jeans, tennis shoes and tshirts in their red ford bronoc in the firing center this last weekend when the wind was so fricking cold u had to have a jacket on in the moring if you got out and hunted at all.  They get out and free hand shoot at deer over 300 yards away.  I was watching the deer in my spotting scope until these aholes drove up and started shooting at them.  and then ask for my help where they ran to and if they hit them.  No joke never walked out to see if there was blood just drove off.  Asked the wrong person for help...prefect example of all my indian experinces hunting...

What were their names?

Good question, did you get any information other than red bronco?  Lic. plate, names, ages, description, pictures or video?

[longknife]

724, if that's what you believe then okay.  I beg to differ on your comment,

"so far the indians on this site proclaim to do everything they can to keep things the way they are, yourself included.  problem areas have been discussed, but solutions from the indian members are few and far between.  when the non-indians propose a change, the stonewalling with the treaty begins anew.  until indians accept there is a problem with the way the treaties and/or big game regulations are administered, there will be no end."

When have I ever stated I wanted to keep things the way they are?  Not once, I've stated many times, "as long as I'm breathing I'm going to do everything in my power to make sure the Treaty isn't abolished" but not once have I stated things remain the same.  I've stated numerous times that things should be reviewed and updated as needed and somethings should be changed to better regulate the harvest.

I've also stated that I am in no position of authority (Tribal Council) to make those changes and as far as I know nobody else on here is either.  We didn't create, write or have a say in anything currently in the books but we do have a say now as to how things should be changed. 

I for one have voiced my distaste for the overharvesting of animals such as 9 bulls in one year or dumping salmon by the truckloads to rot.  Do I know firsthand or witnessed the salmon wastage?  No, I only know what I hear and until there is some proof, (i.e. video or pictures) then it is only speculation.  Do I see the overharvesting of elk?  Yes and No, do I agree with what they are doing, no I don't but as long as it's legal then there is nothing that can be done.

I to thought this thread was put to bed but it hasn't been.  TwoFeet if you believe it's BS then why read it?

Do you go to the board  of tribal council to try to make change? You say you are not on the board, but are you willing to talk?
This would definatly increase impact on wildlife, as well as relations with others...a win win for everyone.

[colockumelk]

OF COURSE THEY DIDN'T GET PICS OR INFO!!!!!!  Come on people document this otherwise its just hearsey. We All KNOW IT HAPPENS but document it. Things will not change public opinion will not change arrests and citations will not change unless you take pics and get plate numbers.

You all expect Plateau to go to his council with these issues right. Well give him a reason, give him something with which to take to the council. He would look stupid if he went to the council with "I heard this or that took place.". I mean honestly what do you expect him to do with rumors. We need, he needs actual evidence.  So stop nagging on him to make changes until you give him a leg to stand on. And for some do you go talk to the wdfw to make changes. Do you write letters to politicians?

[longknife]

OF COURSE THEY DIDN'T GET PICS OR INFO!!!!!!  Come on people document this otherwise its just hearsey. We All KNOW IT HAPPENS but document it. Things will not change public opinion will not change arrests and citations will not change unless you take pics and get plate numbers.

You all expect Plateau to go to his council with these issues right. Well give him a reason, give him something with which to take to the council. He would look stupid if he went to the council with "I heard this or that took place.". I mean honestly what do you expect him to do with rumors. We need, he needs actual evidence.  So stop tagging on him to make changes until you give him a leg to stand on. And for some do you go talk to the wdfw to male changes. Do you write letters to politicians?

I was stating the fact plateau says he dosent have a seat(tribal council) for conservation changes.He said he dosent believe its rite, and wants to change it, but he cant do anything, hands are tied.
 I see evidence, it will be recorded, and i wont be going to the police/wardens/tribal cops, it will be the press! Politicians need something good to win elections!

[colockumelk]

Longknife that post wasnt directed specifically at you. If you felt that way I'm sorry. A lot of people expect him to work miracles with nothing. If you get pics the politicians don't care but the press does.  If its illegal turn it over to the cops. If its legal but unethical turn it over to the press.

[igotbigbulls]

but whats unethical colock? a tribal member with 2 cow elk in their truck? or 2 bulls? or 3 deer? if you take a pic of a tribal member with 2 cows and a deer is that unethical?  just curious on the defintion of unethical. not trying to start anything just getting a consensus on the matter.

[hunter360]

but whats unethical colock? a tribal member with 2 cow elk in their truck? or 2 bulls? or 3 deer? if you take a pic of a tribal member with 2 cows and a deer is that unethical?  just curious on the defintion of unethical. not trying to start anything just getting a consensus on the matter.

unethical is indians having anything more than what everyone else is allowed period. 

[whiteeyes]

Unethical is Advanced Hunters slaughtering elk in the middle of sagebrush not hurting anything in the middle of January. 

[colockumelk]

but whats unethical colock? a tribal member with 2 cow elk in their truck? or 2 bulls? or 3 deer? if you take a pic of a tribal member with 2 cows and a deer is that unethical?  just curious on the defintion of unethical. not trying to start anything just getting a consensus on the matter.

That is a legitimate and good question igotbigbulls.  To answer your question I don't know.  It would be up to the person taking the picture.  If they feel its unethical then send it to the press.  My intent was not to start an ethics debate it was simply to say stop complaining about it and instead do something about it such as taking pictures. 

As far as the examples you listed I don't think any one of them would be picture worthy.  Unless maybe it was in an area such as the Colockum that has such a low bull to cow ratio then yes maybe a picture of 2 bulls in a truck could be unethical.  If it was by a single tribal member.  If 1 bull per tribal member than no. Maybe if the above example was near a place where the elk are fed.  Again the purpose was to say "stop just talking about it and saying I saw this or that."  Instead people should document it and take pictures if it bothers them and send it to the appropriate people.  A sort of "put your money where your mouth is" kind of thing.   

[colockumelk]

Unethical is Advanced Hunters slaughtering elk in the middle of sagebrush not hurting anything in the middle of January.

Got any pictures or evidence to back this up.  Or is this just some more rumors and hearsey.  ?? 

whiteeyes I'll take your bait.  So how is the above "slaughtering" considering that they can only shoot one cow per year per person?  Compare that to how the Yakamas can go into the winter range in the sage brush and a single tribal member can harvest as many elk as they want. I think the second one is closer to "slaughtering" if you ask me.  Your pretty much contradicting yourself aren't you?

[longknife]

ANY pics, or video will go to the press! Tired of people not seeing whats happening, it is a racial problem, and needs correcting.

I would really see/give more respect if you natives followed the same rules, and conservation we all have to, as Americans.

[whiteeyes]

Unethical is Advanced Hunters slaughtering elk in the middle of sagebrush not hurting anything in the middle of January.

Got any pictures or evidence to back this up.  Or is this just some more rumors and hearsey.  ?? 

whiteeyes I'll take your bait.  So how is the above "slaughtering" considering that they can only shoot one cow per year per person?  Compare that to how the Yakamas can go into the winter range in the sage brush and a single tribal member can harvest as many elk as they want. I think the second one is closer to "slaughtering" if you ask me.  Your pretty much contradicting yourself aren't you?

Contradicting no.  Tribal don't shoot cows after December 31.

[coachcw]

why would you have to shoot any elk period after december 31st ?  you must have a bunch of freezers pal and eat elk three meals aday .

[colockumelk]

Okay so let me get this strait.  So you consider it "slaughtering" for a licensed hunter to kill 1 cow per licensed hunter, in an area that has WAY WAY too many cows per bull.  But.....

In the same area that is really hurting for bulls and has a bull to cow ratio 4 times lower than what it should be.  You think it is perfectly fine and NOT considered "slaughtering" for a tribal member to go into this same area and harvest multiple branch bulls.  Basically a tribal member can shoot as many branch bulls as they want.  No limit.  And you don't think that you're contradicting yourself?   

I'm literally blown away.  I'd love to hear your reasoning for this.  I really would.  I don't think you're gonna win this argument, I really don't.  And the term "slaughtering" is your term not mine.   I'm really trying to understand your reasoning and help you out.  But you're gonna have to come up with something else because you're not gonna gain much traction on this one.   

[whiteeyes]

why would you have to shoot any elk period after december 31st ?  you must have a bunch of freezers pal and eat elk three meals aday .

If your directing that at me, I don't  shoot anything after December 31 pal.