youth elk gun

[KillBilly]

Here is a little real world data.

7mm-08 140g bullet: 100 yards 2053ft-lbs   200 yards 1761ft-lbs  300 yards 1502ft-lbs

308 150g bullet: 100 yards 2251ft-lbs    200 yards 1919ft-lbs  300 yards 1626ft-lbs

So you are telling me that you think the 308 will be o.k and the 7mm-08 won't be at 200 yards because of 158ft-lbs difference? I don't think so. Most professional hunters will base there ideas on 1000ft-lbs to cleanly take most big game animals.

Then you also say that the savage 300 would be good to 150 yards, but not the 7mm-08? Ok lets look at those numbers.

7mm-08 140g bullet:  100 yards 2053ft-lbs   200 yards 1761ft-lbs  300 yards 1502ft-lbs
300 savage 150g bullet: 100 yards 1816ft-lbs  200 yards 1413ft-lbs  300 yards 1086ft-lbs

So how you think the 300 savage is better and has more range and killing power then the 7mm-08 I am not sure of

All of these numbers are from winchester.com You can double check them if you like. If you are going to put comparisons up you need to keep the bullets close to get a accurate picture.

I also know of a native amercian hunter that took close to 100 head of elk in his life with nothing but a 243win.

A small caliber bullet placed in the vitals is better then any magnum outside the vitals. So I don't know how anyone can say a 243 is just to small.

 

[D-Rock425]

I shoot a 7mm-08 and would have no problem shooting an elk with it.  I've killed 5 black bears with it and none of them went more than 30 yards. 

[C-Money]

All the 7mm-08 haters just dont know what they are missing. You wont find a hunter in the C-Money clan using a giant super ultra magnum. 7mm-08 & .270win are more than fine! I sure would have liked to have had on film how hard & instantly my Cow elk hit the ground from one, well placed, lung shot from my 270win this past fall.
Hope the youth hunter has much success in the up coming season!

[h2ofowlr]

I know plenty of guys switching to .300 RUM's and I have to think why?  Why shoot a gun that beats the crap out of you when you can kill an elk just fine with a 30-06.  Learn to be a good shot and take good shots and calibers like the .308, 7mm-08, etc. will be plenty good.
Look back in the books, .243 killed a lot of game.

[addicted]

I was looking through a reloading manual this last december and I was down right frustrated how efficient the 7mm-08 was when compaired to my 7x64(kinda like a 284-06).Even with bullets over 160 grains.  There was really nothing notable ballistically to warrant that extra 3/8" of powder, recoil, and cost.

The 7mm08 ballistically and energy wise is very close to cartridges like 30.06, 270, 280.  The 308 casing appears to be very efficient and the 7mm bullets can pop better energy than their 30 cal counterparts because of the BC and speed related to their slightly sleeker design which also correlates to better MPBR which is important to some hunters looking for a point and shoot rig.

140grn bullets
7mm08 2860fps
280REM 3000fps
7mmMAG 3150fps

You can see that the 7-08 is within 10% of the speed of the 7mm remington Magnum while utilizing half as much powder. This shorter cartridge will produce less recoil and fit into a much handier lighter rifle as well which is part of the goal of this thread i would think.

lets go a bit further

162-165 grain bullets
7mm08 2760fps
308win 2700fps
30.06Sprng 2800fps

Well look at that..... 308 gets wooped and its practically identical to the 06....... but wait, it gets better. Since the 7mm bullet has a better BC than the 30 cal bullet in the same weight it has a higher BC meaning that it will overtake the 30cal bullet in speed and energy down range.  The 30 cal cartridges don't  start to out run the 7-08 until you step up to the 300winmag which boasts 3120fps with the 165grn bullets.  But 300win is probably not the best option for a youth or new shooter.

If you were to reload, the bullet choices you have are mind boggling due to the popularity of 7mm cartridges over the years.  Bullet selection is only out matched by the 30 cal bullets and most weights the 30 cal bullets are available in, the 7mm bullets are available as well.


You can see there is no reason to bash the 7mm-08.  Not only in these numbers but also the fact that the ever growing popularity of the cartridge has not built the cartridge above and beyond wildcat status, but has nearly made it a household name in a time of nearly merciless widespread magnumitis.

When it boils down to it, they all kill if put in the right spot, but there are several slight advantages in ballistics and efficiency in favor of the 7mm08. 

[bobcat]

I would go with the 308 over the 7/08, just because of lower priced ammo and better availability. Yes, some 7mm bullets will have higher ballistic coefficients than the 308 caliber bullets, but this really only makes a difference when you get out to 400 yards or so, and even then it's not enough that you could say the 7/08 could make the shot and the 308 couldn't.

There's nothing wrong with the 7/08, I just don't think it's a significant improvement over the old 308. For a reloader I might recommend the 7mm, but if you're only buying factory ammo, go with the 308 for sure.

[carpsniperg2]

Understand your points bobcat. The point behind this was to prove to someone that the 7mm-08 is just as equal or in the long run "ballistics and bc wise" better then the 308. So to say the 308 can go to 200 yards and the 7mm-08 can only for to 100 and its not good enough at that, well that is just flat out wrong!

[bobcat]

Understand your points bobcat. The point behind this was to prove to someone that the 7mm-08 is just as equal or in the long run "ballistics and bc wise" better then the 308. So to say the 308 can go to 200 yards and the 7mm-08 can only for to 100 and its not good enough at that, well that is just flat out wrong!

I definitely agree with that. In my mind, the 7/08 and 308 are virtually identical in all respects. (other than the price of ammo)

[carpsniperg2]

Agree, they are very very close. There is some areas the 308 does better and others the 7mm-08 does better. So its like a wash in my mind. So to say one is so much better then the other is false.

I have always found the price of the 2 for ammo to be almost the same when I have looked. Like at bi mart I think there is maybe like 2-3.00 a box difference. I don't think to many avg joe shooters will burn more then a few boxes a year. So even if you say in a whole year the difference is 30.00 on the high side. Heck that isn't even a 1/4 tank of gas for me

Both have a killer range of bullets as well for the handloader.

[bear hunter]

 
[/quote]
I don't know how you can figure a 7mm-08 is to light for elk and only good to 100 yards. That makes no sense to me. First off you need to compare bullets close to the same weight. Not 140 in the 7mm-08 to the 180 in the 308. Of course your going to have more ke when you do that. All of the ones listed will take a elk to 200y or more very easy and have plenty of ke to get the job done So I don't know how you figure they are not good elk catridges.
[/quote]


 I was quoting what the book said. It's a good round for deer out to 300,but for Elk you should keep the range around 100yds. I'm not saying there not good elk rounds I wiould pick the .308 over the 7mm-08 any day. you can't compare them. The bigest fac. round for the 7mm-08 is 140gr which the the .308 in 180gr beats. Al I am saying is your limited to the distance you can make a clean humane kill. The only rounds I would not use is the 25-06 and .243 win the bullet weights are just the small for Elk.

[bear hunter]

Here is a little real world data.

7mm-08 140g bullet: 100 yards 2053ft-lbs   200 yards 1761ft-lbs  300 yards 1502ft-lbs

308 150g bullet: 100 yards 2251ft-lbs    200 yards 1919ft-lbs  300 yards 1626ft-lbs

So you are telling me that you think the 308 will be o.k and the 7mm-08 won't be at 200 yards because of 158ft-lbs difference? I don't think so. Most professional hunters will base there ideas on 1000ft-lbs to cleanly take most big game animals.

Then you also say that the savage 300 would be good to 150 yards, but not the 7mm-08? Ok lets look at those numbers.

7mm-08 140g bullet:  100 yards 2053ft-lbs   200 yards 1761ft-lbs  300 yards 1502ft-lbs
300 savage 150g bullet: 100 yards 1816ft-lbs  200 yards 1413ft-lbs  300 yards 1086ft-lbs

So how you think the 300 savage is better and has more range and killing power then the 7mm-08 I am not sure of

All of these numbers are from winchester.com You can double check them if you like. If you are going to put comparisons up you need to keep the bullets close to get a accurate picture.

I also know of a native amercian hunter that took close to 100 head of elk in his life with nothing but a 243win.

A small caliber bullet placed in the vitals is better then any magnum outside the vitals. So I don't know how anyone can say a 243 is just to small.

I'm just saying most adults can't hit the vital all the time. Do you think a 11 year old with buck feaver using a .243 over a .308 is better. I would go with the .308. This is just my opinion and what I have read in a book. I am not going to get into a debate over the right round for the job. That would last a life time. Hell Eskimas like to shoot Polar bear with .223 would I hell no. Most poacher use .22 rf ,but that doesn't mean that it is good for big game. I also wouldn't use 150gr for the 300 sav or 308. I would stick with the 180gr bullets for elk ( My opinion again)

[BOWHUNTER45]

  I also agree with everyone else ...that 7mm-08 is tuff to beat ..same with the 308 which are so close no need to even think about it 

[bear hunter]

I know plenty of guys switching to .300 RUM's and I have to think why?  Why shoot a gun that beats the crap out of you when you can kill an elk just fine with a 30-06.  Learn to be a good shot and take good shots and calibers like the .308, 7mm-08, etc. will be plenty good.
Look back in the books, .243 killed a lot of game.

I'm not talking about .300 rum's or the 30-06. I have killed a lot with the 30-06 I love it. All I was saying is what the book said on page 48-49 it is a suggested effective range in yards on game. (JUST A SUGGESTION) I have a .243 win I like it to,but it would be my last choice over my other calibers. Look at the chart on page 48 It "suggests not to shoot at ELK over 100 yard". It also says the 25-06 is not good for Elk. Just giving my opion just like ever one else. Its just a OPION not a debate. If the 7mm-08 was the only rifle I had YES I would shoot a elk, but I would limit the range to around 150 yards. "But the book says 100yds Just saying"

[Pathfinder101]

I got PathfinderJR a youth model .308 a couple of years ago.  The reason I went with the .308 was so he could use it for elk. 

[bear hunter]

 :yeah:I AM NOT SAYING THESE ARE BAD ROUND. I WAS QUATING OUT OF A BOOK CALLED "SHOTS AT BIG GAME" BY CRAIG BODDINGTON ON PAGE 48 -49 (It is a Game suitability suggested effective ranges (in yards) on game thats all.  I think its  how I can say a round that I would not personally use on elk would hit a nerve.