White River Greenwater USFS road closures - access travel mgt plan

[timberfaller]

As my retired USFS(timber crew manager)buddy told me not to many years ago, $$$$$$$$ for road decommissioning come "ear marked" from DC,   YOUR public meeting will hold no sway over their agenda.

Even if the "district" claims to be broke, the $$$$$$$ will be there to destroy/gate/abandon roads.

The only way he could get a timber sale approved was to show "road decommissioning" done in and around the sale area.  Road building was a "red light alert" to the Environmental Attorneys sitting in the wings with their injunctions to STOP and proposed timber sale.

But by all means attend the "public meetings"!  It makes "kudos"  for those putting them on!  They live for "feathers in their cap" helps if they decide to transfer to another district!!

[trophyhunt]

Adopt a road plan!  They could have volunteers adopt certain roads or part of roads, those people would clear the road of trees.  If heavy equipment was needed the forest service could pay for the rental, rock or whatever.  I will start, I volunteer to take care of corral pass road!!

[Naches Sportsman]

Clear a tree, clean a culvert. Hunters and ohv'ers already do a better job at maintaining roads than the forest circus does.

[netcoyote]

Another example of volunteer work to repair FS roads.
Lewis County Chapter of Back Country Horsemen repaired the roads that were washed out to Cody and Keenes Horse Camps. See photos at lcbch.org
FS #21 is the only access to the horse camps - main roads are rough. Trails out of the camps have not been cleared yet.

https://scontent.fsnc1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13434808_591163437731292_1105696040795990108_n.jpg?oh=3bb199c62ea4d1e46c8b7dfaccc4b315&oe=57CA5644[/img]]

https://scontent.fsnc1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13495281_591163744397928_8414370937863278114_n.jpg?oh=62a6c337aaf31b1981347c6082734883&oe=57CF4B38[/img]]

[westside bull]

Adopt a road plan!  They could have volunteers adopt certain roads or part of roads, those people would clear the road of trees.  If heavy equipment was needed the forest service could pay for the rental, rock or whatever.  I will start, I volunteer to take care of corral pass road!!

[Skyvalhunter]

They are too afraid of liability if private people went out and did the work regardless if they signed a waiver form or not. Kind of like when they had all the private heavy equipment owners wanting to help with the fires and they shot them all down.

[Special T]

If your trying to work with/against the uses then you really need to read "the tinderbox; how political correctness ruined the usfs"

I think saving important roads and volunteer  work are the only viable ways to stave off  huge closures. Logger is right that timber sales would take care of much of this. The usfs really isn't into selling timber anymore. Which is why they are a net $user instead of producer with a bye product of more public access.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[netcoyote]

They are too afraid of liability if private people went out and did the work regardless if they signed a waiver form or not. Kind of like when they had all the private heavy equipment owners wanting to help with the fires and they shot them all down.

I think some in the FS are getting over the liability concern. They have an established policy of allowing volunteers to clear trails using equipment, including chainsaws. Their concern was that there would be liability if they just allowed people to start doing it without training and supervision. They have a program of certifying instructors and sawyers and building relationships with trail teams that seams to be working quite well. I personally have a "Class C" sawyer certification and own my own equipment and safety gear approved by the FS. Sure, it's a commitment of time and money, but I've spent a lot of time in the forests in my past and now that I have more time available (retired) I feel it is a good way to pay back. I want my kids and grandkids to have the same access that I had. It's an uphill battle but it's got to be done.

[swanny]

They are too afraid of liability if private people went out and did the work regardless if they signed a waiver form or not. Kind of like when they had all the private heavy equipment owners wanting to help with the fires and they shot them all down.

I think some in the FS are getting over the liability concern. They have an established policy of allowing volunteers to clear trails using equipment, including chainsaws. Their concern was that there would be liability if they just allowed people to start doing it without training and supervision. They have a program of certifying instructors and sawyers and building relationships with trail teams that seams to be working quite well. I personally have a "Class C" sawyer certification and own my own equipment and safety gear approved by the FS. Sure, it's a commitment of time and money, but I've spent a lot of time in the forests in my past and now that I have more time available (retired) I feel it is a good way to pay back. I want my kids and grandkids to have the same access that I had. It's an uphill battle but it's got to be done.

Was just going to say this. I know Evergreen MTB Alliance has and holds sawyer classes for the trail building they do on USFS land. I'm sure they could agree to the same type of set up for volunteer forest road clearing/management.

[ElaphusElatus]

The draft decision notice for this project has been posted, Alternative 3 is their preferred alt. There are 122 responses to comments received in Appendix D. Objections due by about Jan 5 or 6.
http://www.fs.usda.gov/project/?project=47991

[RB]

As my retired USFS(timber crew manager)buddy told me not to many years ago, $$$$$$$$ for road decommissioning come "ear marked" from DC,   YOUR public meeting will hold no sway over their agenda.

Even if the "district" claims to be broke, the $$$$$$$ will be there to destroy/gate/abandon roads.


 

Always found it ironic that they had enough money to haul in loads of boulders to block a road, but sometimes the same amount of "fill" could have fixed a road.

[trophyhunt]

My biggest concern, those roads that are closed, are they blocking them off or putting gates on them?  We all know who will get the keys if they gate them!

[bigtex]

My biggest concern, those roads that are closed, are they blocking them off or putting gates on them?  We all know who will get the keys if they gate them!

There's basically two types of things that will really cause a visible impact:

One is that some roads are to be decommissioned, which means the road surface will be torn up and seed will be planted. Basically the road is gone.

The other is some roads will be closed, but the road itself will remain. That is where the question will be will it be blocked by a gate or boulders? Each pose positives and negatives. Boulders keep everyone out, but can be hard to move in an emergency. Gates can be easily accessed in an emergency but there's the risk of locks being cut off, keys being handed out, and they're also costly.

[netcoyote]

These are the maps of the FS final proposal:
http://a123.g.akamai.net/7/123/11558/abc123/forestservic.download.akamai.com/11558/www/nepa/102767_FSPLT3_3906969.pdf

The red roads will be decommissioned. The yellow will be "closed", not clear on the method. The green will remain open.

[logger]

I have a hard time with the forest service closing any road, My company decommissions roads for them and it drives me nuts to rip out a road that could be in pretty good shape with minimal maintnance, $270,000 to rip out six miles almost perfectly good road, for that kind of money we could have fixed up alot of system roads and I mean alot, some are as simple as cleaning the ditch and culverts and brushing the road doesn't take near as much money or effort as the forest service would like to make out.