wolf management will cost $2.3 million in 2013

[bobcat]

bobcat, are you afraid of the wolves?? the eastern side is already seeing the effects of the wolves. delisted by the feds. wash wont delist untill thier goal is met. you seem to be against the state meeting the goal.as long as it stays on the eastern side of the state its ok but you dont want them over on the west side??
thats ok as far as im conserned but you have to let the people on the eastern side deal with them. if not, then yes- take some over there so management can procede.

Heck no I don't want them in the areas I hunt! I don't believe they'd entirely wipe out deer and elk, but at the least they would move them around, possibly out of places I hunt and into places I can't.

Why would I want my hunting success to become more difficult than it already is?

I don't care if wolf numbers reach the WDFW's "goal" or not. However I'm sure they will eventually. The less wolves the better as far as I'm concerned.

[duckmen1]

Exactly. We have enough trouble finding animals in the brush as it is. The state did a study on blacktail fawn survival and out of 13 radio collared 11 died most from predators. Lets kill the last two that survived while were at it with wolves.
I don't want them in eastern wa either but it is too late now.

[danderson]

 That quote might be off the online hunter education program but I can assure you that's not being taught in the hands on classroom program, like I said before the pro-wolf loving contingent has taken over the wing of hunter education and wants to eliminate the traditional class all together and make it an computer generated scaled down version, with selected instructors doing a 4 hour skills online class evaluation, the 20.00 fee charged for the registration will pay for wolf mitigation, at least that's there plan,  the master hunters have been sent letters explaining the great shortage of qualified instructors in the state and they want them to all get certified, the decision makers in the WDW, not sure if its the wildlife commission or some headhunter in Olympia have miss calculated the number of instructors that will stay in the program,  the call has gone out for the so called masters of hunting to take over, this fits into there long range goal of charging fees for everything from shed hunting, bird watching, whale watching, flower picking you name it, the introduction of wolfs has sped up the time line for the decline of wildlife populations in the state, we all know that hunting as we have known it will never be the same if we wait for the experts to make a decision, Eastern Washington should be considered  a zone and western Washington another zone, we cant continue to let a mostly urbanized west side community making decisions for ranchers and farmers and rural residents that have a vastly different out look on whats considered quality of life.

Don't blame WDFW?

I posted this on another thread but this is a cut paste job off of the hunters safety program (online) that is teaching our new hunters a thing or two about their role in managing wildlife.

If we try to eliminate predators, more animals will die from other causes, including hunting, disease and accidents.

 

[Gringo31]

Agree with you...

I've never been concerned about the individual person spending his time to help teach educate etc....

My issue is the State (and gov't in general) pushing what THEY think we all need to believe.  Does WDFW make it's decisions on science or is it just a vote of what people want?  Should we have politicians in charge or people who understand how to manage wildlife for long term sustainability with "we the people" getting to harvest the excess as it allows?

[huntnphool]

That quote might be off the online hunter education program but I can assure you that's not being taught in the hands on classroom program, like I said before the pro-wolf loving contingent has taken over the wing of hunter education and wants to eliminate the traditional class all together and make it an computer generated scaled down version, with selected instructors doing a 4 hour skills online class evaluation, the 20.00 fee charged for the registration will pay for wolf mitigation, at least that's there plan,  the master hunters have been sent letters explaining the great shortage of qualified instructors in the state and they want them to all get certified, the decision makers in the WDW, not sure if its the wildlife commission or some headhunter in Olympia have miss calculated the number of instructors that will stay in the program,  the call has gone out for the so called masters of hunting to take over, this fits into there long range goal of charging fees for everything from shed hunting, bird watching, whale watching, flower picking you name it, the introduction of wolfs has sped up the time line for the decline of wildlife populations in the state, we all know that hunting as we have known it will never be the same if we wait for the experts to make a decision, Eastern Washington should be considered  a zone and western Washington another zone, we cant continue to let a mostly urbanized west side community making decisions for ranchers and farmers and rural residents that have a vastly different out look on whats considered quality of life.

Well said.

[dreamunelk]

Exactly. We have enough trouble finding animals in the brush as it is. The state did a study on blacktail fawn survival and out of 13 radio collared 11 died most from predators. Lets kill the last two that survived while were at it with wolves.
I don't want them in eastern wa either but it is too late now.

What study?  I know they have an ongoing study on fawn and doe survival.  My understanding it will be several years before any hypothesis can be tested and there for no results until them. 

[dreamunelk]

Here is a good mortality study.  Read the whole thing and don't quote a sentence with out understanding it.

http://access.nwifc.org/wildlife/documents/makah-fawn-report-final-201102.pdf

Something we should all remember.  Also Leopold, basically the father of North American model of wildlife management, acknowledged later in life the predator reduction was a mistake.  It lead to disease and over population.  Of course now all the private hunting clubs and leases have made it worse. 

[duckmen1]

The study was in an article from nw sportsman read the magazine you will see it. I will check to see what issue

[dreamunelk]

I think what they were referring to was one sub sample (cluster) of the total sample.  What the WDFW is doing is a long term study over many different areas if I understand it correctly.   NW sportsman does a good job but, they do keep it simple and people may have misunderstood and just posted one seasons results for one sample.  Young mortality of 50% up to 90% is not that unusual in nature.  It is the way things are.  To much human meddling could actually make it far worse.

Just to provide an example of how a little bit of data can confuse the issues.  On one elk calve study the first year there was an almost 100% survival so using that everything looked great.   The next year it was the opposite.  I think it was a three or four year study.  Still waiting for that paper to be published so I can find out what the modeling teased out of it.  I am betting when all was said and done it was about a 50 - 60% survival which is pretty good and so long as adult cow mortality is not to high would lead to a stable to increasing population.

[skywalker253]

All this talk about WDFW and the FEDS need to let hunters manage wolves. Do people on here really think they need to be managed yet?

I am not aganist managing them. In fact; I don't want wolves in Wa at all. Just saying; if we are going to be forced to let wolves live here, then give them a chance to populate and get settled, before we start hunting them. I don't think the WDFW or the FEDS plan to NOT let us hunt them. It is only a matter of time before wolves reach the management plan goals and they are delisted to hunt in WA. I am guessing within 5-10 years wolves will be hunted under a special permit draw. Wait to bash the game department until their management plan is deemed a total failure. Kinda hard to judge them, when the wolf management plan goals have not even been completed yet. Just saying; give the program a chance to become the program it is suppose to be, and give the WDFW a chance to show us that they don't know or do know what they are doing. Many will bash the WDFW regardless of what the outcome is, so what does it matter....

[huntnphool]

I am guessing within 5-10 years wolves will be hunted under a special permit draw.

Its ok to be optimistic, but this same question asked of WDFW I will now ask of you. What makes you think it will be any different than Idaho, Montana and Wyoming?

[dreamunelk]

Good question huntnpholl.  I guess we can all be hopeful but, I think the antis are winding up to fight any hunting.  Since the WDFW is getting bashed by all and did not get any support from hunters when the smacked the wedge pack my guess is they will get slaughtered when they propose it.  On the interesting side if people take the time to read the Wolf plan.  Yes, I know it hurts and makes one want to bang their head on the wall.   I think people will find that there is sufficient language to aid the process of having hunts when the time comes.  Five to ten years is not unrealistic.  The big question will be if hunters can represent themselves in a manner that won't help the antis.

[skywalker253]

I am guessing within 5-10 years wolves will be hunted under a special permit draw.

Its ok to be optimistic, but this same question asked of WDFW I will now ask of you. What makes you think it will be any different than Idaho, Montana and Wyoming?


All I am saying is IMO in the next 5-10 years we will have a special permit hunt, which will be broke up by wolf region. Maybe they don't go with a special permit draw, and they create a general season with a kill quota attached to each region. My only point is they will be available to hunt at some point. Whether that be 2 years from now or 20 years from now; I don't care. Just saying that we will be provided a privledge to hunt them at some point IMO....

[skywalker253]

Good question huntnpholl.  I guess we can all be hopeful but, I think the antis are winding up to fight any hunting.  Since the WDFW is getting bashed by all and did not get any support from hunters when the smacked the wedge pack my guess is they will get slaughtered when they propose it.  On the interesting side if people take the time to read the Wolf plan.  Yes, I know it hurts and makes one want to bang their head on the wall.   I think people will find that there is sufficient language to aid the process of having hunts when the time comes.  Five to ten years is not unrealistic.  The big question will be if hunters can represent themselves in a manner that won't help the antis.

And if I am understanding HP question...

Because MONEY $$$ and POWER is what modivates politicians. If the WDFW can justify a wolf season equals X amount of dollars $$$; then IMO it is more likely to happen then not. Despite what the tree huggers may want. Politicians go where the money is.

[bobcat]

All this talk about WDFW and the FEDS need to let hunters manage wolves. Do people on here really think they need to be managed yet?

I am not aganist managing them. In fact; I don't want wolves in Wa at all. Just saying; if we are going to be forced to let wolves live here, then give them a chance to populate and get settled, before we start hunting them. I don't think the WDFW or the FEDS plan to NOT let us hunt them. It is only a matter of time before wolves reach the management plan goals and they are delisted to hunt in WA. I am guessing within 5-10 years wolves will be hunted under a special permit draw. Wait to bash the game department until their management plan is deemed a total failure. Kinda hard to judge them, when the wolf management plan goals have not even been completed yet. Just saying; give the program a chance to become the program it is suppose to be, and give the WDFW a chance to show us that they don't know or do know what they are doing. Many will bash the WDFW regardless of what the outcome is, so what does it matter....

    Well said!   

I wish I would've wrote that.