Bellingham to pay man $15000 for harrassment

[Bean Counter]

Granted, I used those examples as "over-the-top" extensions of the logic to illustrate my point.  I agree they are not likely to be something someone would seriously consider getting compensation for.  But in this case, are you saying you would have contacted an attorney about being unjustifiably drawn upon and used their services to seek "damages" from the municipality? What would the basis of your damage claim been?

There is a difference between compensatory damages and punitive damages.

[MP123]

The city of Bellingham was very lucky they could settle this for $15k.  And yes, that cop should be fired.

[3nails]

 I just heard the guy donated the money back to the department on condition they use it to better train officers in open carry. Anyone else heard this?

[JLS]

An officer pointing a firearm at a citizen has been found by the courts to be a use of force.  Thus, it can fall under an excessive use of force claim if they do so and it was not warranted.

The officer should not be pointing his firearm at a suspect when he draws it, unless he intends to pull the trigger.  That is what every agency in the state should be teaching and is what new recruits are taught at the academy.  Old habits die hard though, and many veteran officers who were trained differently still do this inadvertantly.

I highly doubt the cop will be fired, and based upon reading the victim's account on the Open Carry forum, it doesn't sound like he should be.

[GoldTip]

I must admit, I am quite surprised at the overwhelmingly liberal point of view almost every single poster has on this thread.   Really, really surprised, and saddened.

[pianoman9701]

I must admit, I am quite surprised at the overwhelmingly liberal point of view almost every single poster has on this thread.   Really, really surprised, and saddened.

I can't wait to hear what you're calling a liberal point of view. This should be good. Please be more specific. Thanks. 

[JJD]

The guy was probably NOT going to get any kind of an apology until an attorney got involved.  The only real winner here was likely the attorney who likely got most of the $$.  The only time things like this seem to change is when it ends up in the public eye, via the media.  If the legal avenue had not been taken, the incident would have been swept under the rug and nothing would have changed.  While it might be 15k out of our own pocket, it might be $$ well spent.

[JLS]

The guy was probably NOT going to get any kind of an apology until an attorney got involved.  The only real winner here was likely the attorney who likely got most of the $$.  The only time things like this seem to change is when it ends up in the public eye, via the media.  If the legal avenue had not been taken, the incident would have been swept under the rug and nothing would have changed.  While it might be 15k out of our own pocket, it might be $$ well spent.

Actually, per the man's own account the officer did apologize at the time.

[GoldTip]

I must admit, I am quite surprised at the overwhelmingly liberal point of view almost every single poster has on this thread.   Really, really surprised, and saddened.

I can't wait to hear what you're calling a liberal point of view. This should be good. Please be more specific. Thanks. 

OK, you asked for it.  Anyone who expects something for nothing.  Which in my experience is exactly what happened here, imho.  The Master Seargent deserved no more than an apology in my opinion, and assurances it wouldn't happen again.  All said and done, for what we know, the officer was just doing his job.  Someone called and complained that there was a man in the park walking around carrying a gun, the officer responded and most likely felt he was doing his job.  Was he over zealous yes,  should he have known the law, yes.  Does the Master Seargent deserve an apology, yes.  And that's all in my opinion.

Someone expressed the opinion on this thread that maybe they deserve a settlement for pain and suffering following a car accident.  If they are disabled and can not work, then yes, I agree they do deserve a settlement.  Do they deserve having their wages paid while they can't work and have their car fixed yes.  Do they deserve to get money because they had a stiff neck for 2 weeks and couldn't go on their evening walk with their little sweetie, simply because someone ACCIDENTLY hit the gas when they should have hit the brake.  ABSOLUTELY NOT.  It was an ACCIDENT, period.  That and the feeling the Master Seargent should be paid simply for having a gun pointed at him, those are LIBERAL sentiments, expecting something for nothing.  Just my honest opinion, and when the country started feeling that way it has become a slippery slope, a slippery slope indeed.

[6x6in6]

I must admit, I am quite surprised at the overwhelmingly liberal point of view almost every single poster has on this thread.   Really, really surprised, and saddened.

I can't wait to hear what you're calling a liberal point of view. This should be good. Please be more specific. Thanks. 

OK, you asked for it.  Anyone who expects something for nothing.  Which in my experience is exactly what happened here, imho.  The Master Seargent deserved no more than an apology in my opinion, and assurances it wouldn't happen again.  All said and done, for what we know, the officer was just doing his job.  Someone called and complained that there was a man in the park walking around carrying a gun, the officer responded and most likely felt he was doing his job.  Was he over zealous yes,  should he have known the law, yes.  Does the Master Seargent deserve an apology, yes.  And that's all in my opinion.

Someone expressed the opinion on this thread that maybe they deserve a settlement for pain and suffering following a car accident.  If they are disabled and can not work, then yes, I agree they do deserve a settlement.  Do they deserve having their wages paid while they can't work and have their car fixed yes.  Do they deserve to get money because they had a stiff neck for 2 weeks and couldn't go on their evening walk with their little sweetie, simply because someone ACCIDENTLY hit the gas when they should have hit the brake.  ABSOLUTELY NOT.  It was an ACCIDENT, period.  That and the feeling the Master Seargent should be paid simply for having a gun pointed at him, those are LIBERAL sentiments, expecting something for nothing.  Just my honest opinion, and when the country started feeling that way it has become a slippery slope, a slippery slope indeed.

I completely agree with your opinion.
If what was stated yesterday in this thread that the "victim" in this did indeed turn over the $15k to the Bellingham PD, kudo's to him.  Maybe that, coupled with your opinion, was his agenda on obtaining a settlement only to be turned over for 2A educational purposes.

Sadly enough, none of this will really do squat to educate what is an insanely liberal city in Whatcom County.
I have not, and refuse to, read the comments in the article linked in this thread.  I can just imagine that the posters are all kinds of up in arms over this and are screaming for 2A reform in the city of Bellingham.

[Fl0und3rz]

Your taxes are covering the $15k this guy is getting because of a power tripping cop... does he really deserve a payment of any kind?  Cop deserves to lose his job for unjustifiably pulling on a lawful citizen, I agree 100%. But the guy getting $15k out of a municipal fund for the idiot with a badge's actions?

Ambulance-chaser lawyers are ruining this country.  We are the laughing stock of the world when it comes to frivolous lawsuits. This $15K wasn't paid to compensate for fear, it was paid for his signature to guarantee he won't sue.  Think about that - the city of BHam paid $15K to some guy who suffered no actual loss.  $15K just to keep it out of the courts.  And smart people seem to think this is ok?  Sad.   

OK, you asked for it.  Anyone who expects something for nothing.  Which in my experience is exactly what happened here, imho.  The Master Seargent deserved no more than an apology in my opinion, and assurances it wouldn't happen again. 

Respectfully, see if you can follow this feedback loop.  I am talking in the aggregate here (not any individual cases that one might disagree about).

Police or public officials commit egregious errors -> lawsuits/settlements cost mount -> government services decline or taxes go up -> voters/taxpayers get irked and vote to change or correct problem -> no more egregious errors.

Like it or not, that's the way our system works to correct systematic errors such as this in the OP. Understanding this or supporting this at some level is not liberalism. Rather, it is liberty loving. 

Should the lady whose parents were killed by the repeat DUI offender, who was put in the hospital, and whose newborn baby suffered life-threatening injuries get $45 million?  My opinion is that that sum is on the low side, if it is proven that the municipality failed to perform its duties re: ensuring that the repeat DUI offender completed his sentencing requirements.

If the cops shoot your dog on a mistaken identity no-knock warrant, do you think that a simple apology should suffice? Are simple replacement costs (compensatory damages) sufficient to make you whole? Will such low costs prevent future occurences?  Or should we allow punitive damages (which is likely what formed the basis of the settlement in OP), so that this feedback loop operates as intended to reign in an out of control police state?

These past few years has opened my eyes to the realization about how much I don't want to (or my children to have to) live in an all powerful police state, regardless of whether I agree with the politics of the people currently at the helm.  Liberty loving, not liberalism.

[pianoman9701]

I must admit, I am quite surprised at the overwhelmingly liberal point of view almost every single poster has on this thread.   Really, really surprised, and saddened.

I can't wait to hear what you're calling a liberal point of view. This should be good. Please be more specific. Thanks. 

OK, you asked for it.  Anyone who expects something for nothing.  Which in my experience is exactly what happened here, imho.  The Master Seargent deserved no more than an apology in my opinion, and assurances it wouldn't happen again.  All said and done, for what we know, the officer was just doing his job.  Someone called and complained that there was a man in the park walking around carrying a gun, the officer responded and most likely felt he was doing his job.  Was he over zealous yes,  should he have known the law, yes.  Does the Master Seargent deserve an apology, yes.  And that's all in my opinion.

Someone expressed the opinion on this thread that maybe they deserve a settlement for pain and suffering following a car accident.  If they are disabled and can not work, then yes, I agree they do deserve a settlement.  Do they deserve having their wages paid while they can't work and have their car fixed yes.  Do they deserve to get money because they had a stiff neck for 2 weeks and couldn't go on their evening walk with their little sweetie, simply because someone ACCIDENTLY hit the gas when they should have hit the brake.  ABSOLUTELY NOT.  It was an ACCIDENT, period.  That and the feeling the Master Seargent should be paid simply for having a gun pointed at him, those are LIBERAL sentiments, expecting something for nothing.  Just my honest opinion, and when the country started feeling that way it has become a slippery slope, a slippery slope indeed.

I guess we view what liberal is quite differently. I think of liberals as being in support of big government and allowing government intrusion into their lives because they think we need that. Being a conservative, I view the unnecessary intrusion of our government into our lives as just that - an unnecessary intrusion. In addition, this police officer in effect, threatened the life of a citizen by pointing his loaded weapon at him and it was done for no good reason other than lack of proper training. As has been stated before, awards serve not only to compensate the victim (and the Master Sergeant was absolutely a victim), but serves to demonstrate to the members of our police and the rest of our government that they need to respond to us, their bosses, appropriately. I guarantee that this department will change it's training because of this puny award. They need to before a mistake like this results in an unnecessary death.

As far as your comments about car accidents are concerned, I don't even know what to say except that accidents caused by a driver's error should result in compensation for whatever is truly lost by the injured party. When you make a mistake and get to work late, even though it's a mistake, you pay for your mistake. When you accidentally run into someone and cause them pain and it's clearly your fault, you should pay for their car, their medical, their lost wages, their future medical, as well as pain and suffering when applicable. If I run into a tree, that's on me. If you cause me to be injured, that's on you. I don't think I deserve $5M for a sore neck, but I also think that someone who suffers terribly deserves to be compensated fairly.

[Fl0und3rz]

Agree.  Conservatism = Liberty loving, despite all the rhetoric about war on womynz, anti-science, planet destroying, etc.

[turkeyfeather]

I have to admit I am  bit suprised by Pmans stance on this. That someone should be compensated for unnecessary harrsement by police. When just yesterday in another thread he seemed to be advocating that same thing. Maybe I misunderstood, but that is how it looks. Personally, I think if PD's have to start paying people for their lack of knowledge and mistakes they will end up being better PD's in the long run.

[pianoman9701]

You know the two instances are completely different. You're baiting. I'm not biting. Have a nice day.