Guidance for Hunter Education instructors regarding I-594

[JimmyHoffa]

I'll bet the "Felons" are quacking in their boots today as the new law is in place. Now if we can get another initiative to control the transfer of knives and clubs our communities will really be safe.     

That will be a fun one to read through...background checks every time a little-leaguer goes up to bat.

[Hi-Liter]

Been teaching Hunters Ed for over twenty years, just resigned today.

good hope more follow.

You know I agree with you that you should quit teaching over 594. But, isn't this exactly what the anti-guns want from us? is to quit. Quit owning guns, quit teaching etc.  If we don't have good HE instructors like you then what do we do next? I think you should re-consider and keep moving forward. I am sure you are a great instructor for the last 20 years.

[Windwalker]

More muddy waters - some question the WDFW definitions
http://thecluemeter.blogspot.com/2014/12/washington-state-violates-letter-of.html

A few comments bring up good points - http://www.komonews.com/news/local/Initiative-594-group-calls-for-new-gun-measures-284801571.html

Many questions, conflicts and rumors to dispel.
Bottom line is the Attorney General needs to issue an advisory opinion interpreting it.

[Dave Workman]

I reiterate:

Friendly request:  If everyone who reads and comments here could cut-and-paste their remarks over to Examiner, it would help readers across the country understand fully what we're up against.

[SWWSurplus]

I have to say, don't necessarily believe guidance from Law Enforcement Officers as to what is and is not legal. We get cops in our shop all the time who don't know the law on concealed or open carry of firearms in Washington, and they present non-factual opinion as the law all the time to the public. We get lots of people who tell me their cop neighbor or brother in law told them X when I can read them the law that says Y. We get former or current law enforcement officers in who are surprised or in disagreement when I talk about the laws as I have personally read them.

Some cops back down when confronted with new information. Some, maybe most double down.

The courts and lawyers determine what is legal and interpret the finer point of the law.

[Fl0und3rz]

I have to say, don't necessarily believe guidance from Law Enforcement Officers as to what is and is not legal. We get cops in our shop all the time who don't know the law on concealed or open carry of firearms in Washington, and they present non-factual opinion as the law all the time to the public. We get lots of people who tell me their cop neighbor or brother in law told them X when I can read them the law that says Y. We get former or current law enforcement officers in who are surprised or in disagreement when I talk about the laws as I have personally read them.

Some cops back down when confronted with new information. Some, maybe most double down.

The courts and lawyers determine what is legal and interpret the finer point of the law.

Good point and welcome.  This is somewhat different, though, as an official statement from someone with authority to make it.   That said, there are still many pitfalls, and nobody ever got rich betting that a public official would stick his/her neck out for some regular schmo.

[pianoman9701]

I have to say, don't necessarily believe guidance from Law Enforcement Officers as to what is and is not legal. We get cops in our shop all the time who don't know the law on concealed or open carry of firearms in Washington, and they present non-factual opinion as the law all the time to the public. We get lots of people who tell me their cop neighbor or brother in law told them X when I can read them the law that says Y. We get former or current law enforcement officers in who are surprised or in disagreement when I talk about the laws as I have personally read them.

Some cops back down when confronted with new information. Some, maybe most double down.

The courts and lawyers determine what is legal and interpret the finer point of the law.

Welcome to the forum. Are you the new location over on 4th Plain? If so, I've been a customer of yours for years, both on Andresen and the new place.

And you're very correct; a lot of cops are lacking in their knowledge of the law. A good example would be one requiring you to surrender your firearm upon request for no reason other than his own mental discomfort.

[fishngamereaper]

As a previously assumed fallout, I tried to buy 12ga arial boating flares today. Westmarine pulled them from shelves and would not sell me any. I tried Wholesale and same thing, I called Wally world and was told they have not been given guidance yet on how to sell them... ............this should get interesting. Wonder if I can rent a concrete nail gun???Think i will call my local rental store.

I can see it now, Im sorry sir you are a convicted felon, have a DV conviction and are on a Mental health watch list, I cannoy rent you a nail gun and most certaintly will not sell you flares..

[woodswalker]

yeah i was waiting for that...wonder what the CG is going to do about boaters who cannot BUY the required equipment...likely ticket them.  so doubled down with stupid.  I'm waiting for the lawsuits to fly.

In addition, I think that the first person verifiably harmed needs to file a civil rights suit against the supporters and financiers of the initiative...a suit for whole number mulitples of the net worth of all signers/contributors whose contribution exceeds say $100...

After all, that works for the DOJ right?

[JimmyHoffa]

The actual flares or the kit with a gun and flares?  When I looked through 594 I only saw firearms, not ammo.  There are already laws for selling ammo to a prohibited person.  Odd that as it is now, ammo sold to a prohibited person would net the seller a felony, but selling the actual firearm gets a gross misdemeanor (first offense).

[Dave Workman]

As a previously assumed fallout, I tried to buy 12ga arial boating flares today. Westmarine pulled them from shelves and would not sell me any. I tried Wholesale and same thing, I called Wally world and was told they have not been given guidance yet on how to sell them... ............this should get interesting. Wonder if I can rent a concrete nail gun???Think i will call my local rental store.

I can see it now, Im sorry sir you are a convicted felon, have a DV conviction and are on a Mental health watch list, I cannoy rent you a nail gun and most certaintly will not sell you flares..

Okay, what on earth does this have to do with the OP? We're talking about HUNTER EDUCATION here and the problems related to that because of I-594...not the other problems that apparently are linked to this asinine piece of legislation.

Let's not hijack or derail a thread. The specific problems relating to HUNTER ED need to be fleshed out without any detours.

[Dave Workman]

I have to say, don't necessarily believe guidance from Law Enforcement Officers as to what is and is not legal. We get cops in our shop all the time who don't know the law on concealed or open carry of firearms in Washington, and they present non-factual opinion as the law all the time to the public. We get lots of people who tell me their cop neighbor or brother in law told them X when I can read them the law that says Y. We get former or current law enforcement officers in who are surprised or in disagreement when I talk about the laws as I have personally read them.

Some cops back down when confronted with new information. Some, maybe most double down.

The courts and lawyers determine what is legal and interpret the finer point of the law.

AMEN. Most of you know I write a book on Washington gun laws, and I've had some, er, interesting conversations with people in law enforcement about gun laws, not only in WA but elsewhere.  I've chatted with high-rankers who had never heard of the FOPA. Others who insisted you need a CPL in this state to openly carry a handgun. 

Now, adding to the confusion:

More I-594 fallout as DOL, Revenue issue advisories

Yesterday’s advisory from the Washington Department of Licensing (DOL), following Thursday’s “Special Notice” from the Department of Revenue on “Tax Implications of Firearms transfers” have raised more questions about what voters handed to gun owners with passage of Initiative 594.

http://www.examiner.com/article/more-i-594-fallout-as-dol-revenue-issue-advisories

[Fl0und3rz]

Wind walker raises a good point above whether WDFW is extending the LE exemption beyond statutory authority granted in I594 and existing RCWs.

[Dave Workman]

Wind walker raises a good point above whether WDFW is extending the LE exemption beyond statutory authority granted in I594 and existing RCWs.

Perhaps the e-mail from David Whipple, quoted herein, will provide an answer.  Then again....


Gun control drumbeat starts in Arizona as Washington enters new phase
 
Saturday saw the first steps toward Michael Bloomberg-style gun control in Arizona with the Brady Campaign joining “community leaders and activists” to protest a so-called “bad apple gun dealer,” while the Washington Arms Collectors (WAC) launched its $10 background check program in Monroe, which continues this coming weekend in Puyallup.
 
http://www.examiner.com/article/gun-control-drumbeat-starts-arizona-as-washington-enters-new-phase

[luvmystang67]

When can we launch a new initiative that allows transfer of weapons without background checks for CPL holders? Could that be a new initiative or would that be seen as a modification to the existing initiative with the 2 year limit on it? 

How about also, when you go in to get a background check for a particular sale, you get a card valid for 2 months that allows you to transfer any guns to anyone else with a valid card?

We need to make some "common sense" changes to this ridiculous law.