At what age is a blacktail buck considered mature?

[Parasite]

At what age is a blacktail buck considered mature? I know for whitetails that age is considered 4.5 years. At that point, the bucks main frame is done growing and more resources can be put towards antler growth. Do blacktails follow the same pattern?

[grundy53]

I would say it's the same. Whether whitetail, blacktail, or mule deer.

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[fishnfur]

I agree with that, unless it's the last day of hunting season, in which case, "mature" is a squishy term for anything with antlers. 

[huntnnw]

4.5 and older is a mature deer.. bone structure is fully developed at this age. Prime antler growth occur at 4.5 to 7.5 with some exceptions at older ages, but rare

[Parasite]

Thanks for the help guys. I've got a lot to learn around here.

[Skyvalhunter]

Good thing you learned about blacktail these days is if it has horns its a shooter

[deerhunter_98520]

Good thing you learned about blacktail these days is if it has horns its a shooter

Until you get a few years under your belt I wouldn't hold out for a big one...blacktail are possibly the hardest deer to get a big mature animal, good luck on your adventure! 

[Parasite]

I just wanted a reference point similar to whitetail. Just one more piece to the puzzle.

[Jeeper]

A study in Wisconsin about 20 years ago concluded that a buck that survives it's first 3 & 1/2 years of life, has an 85% chance of dying of old age!

[fishnfur]

If you show more than a passing interest in Blacktail hunting, these books below are considered the two "must read" sources.  Both seem to have gone out of print in the last year, and the prices are going up.  $30 new was the price back when they were still being published.  It looks like that'll get you a used one now, if you're lucky.  Your local library may have a copy, which is a good option.   You might also be able to borrow one from a local forum member.  (I'd loan you mine, but I'd need a set of the keys to your car as collateral to assure their safe return.  )

Lastly, the Capitol Forest, just west of Oly is an excellent place to cut your teeth on scouting around for BTs.  There are a lot of deer in there so it is an excellent training ground.  The place is overrun with hunters during modern firearm season, so I don't recommend it during that season unless you're into truck parades. You'll need a $30 Discover Pass to legally access State lands if you decide to head out there.


https://www.amazon.com/Blacktail-Trophy-Tactics-Boyd-Iverson/dp/0963040510/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1546536479&sr=8-1&keywords=blacktail+trophy+tactics+2

https://www.amazon.com/Trophy-Blacktails-Science-Scott-Haugen/dp/098194230X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1546536660&sr=8-1&keywords=trophy+blacktails+the+science+of+the+hunt

[lokidog]

When he gets laid for the first time......   

[Griiz]

I don’t believe blacktails are generating there best antlers until 7 years or better. They seem to be slow generators in Washington for whatever reason (feed, genes). Using my trail cameras I have had the opportunity to see antler growth over numerous years and it is slow growth.

[singleshot12]

A study in Wisconsin about 20 years ago concluded that a buck that survives it's first 3 & 1/2 years of life, has an 85% chance of dying of old age!

Which makes ya wonder how old bucks really get? Studies claim I think 10-12 years tops. But I bet it's twice that if conditions are favorable and predators are low.

[Mtnwalker]

One thing I might add is don’t assume because a buck is only a 2x2 that he isn’t mature. Especially if you end up out on the coast or up the peninsula, a fair amount of bucks out in that neck of the woods never make it past a 2 point no matter the age.

[npaull]

Which makes ya wonder how old bucks really get? Studies claim I think 10-12 years tops. But I bet it's twice that if conditions are favorable and predators are low.

No I think that's wrong. Virtually everywhere a 10+ male deer is absolutely ancient. Does live a lot longer than bucks, but very, VERY few bucks hit double digits.

Interesting mention on a recent Meat Eater podcast by a deer biologist who found it utterly laughable that guys thought they could age a deer by looking at its body or its antlers. Apparently it's actually been studied and nobody is better than random chance. Tooth age is the only reliable way to go after they're past spikes.

[Griiz]

One thing I might add is don’t assume because a buck is only a 2x2 that he isn’t mature. Especially if you end up out on the coast or up the peninsula, a fair amount of bucks out in that neck of the woods never make it past a 2 point no matter the age.

Noticed the same thing in Mason county.

[Jonathan_S]

Apparently it's actually been studied and nobody is better than random chance. Tooth age is the only reliable way to go after they're past spikes.

That might be the case for the difference between a 4.5-5.5 yr old buck but between 1.5 and 2.5 it's not that hard. Sure there are outliers but it's not hard to separate the baby bucks (younger than 3.5) from the mature ones

[singleshot12]

Which makes ya wonder how old bucks really get? Studies claim I think 10-12 years tops. But I bet it's twice that if conditions are favorable and predators are low.

No I think that's wrong. Virtually everywhere a 10+ male deer is absolutely ancient. Does live a lot longer than bucks, but very, VERY few bucks hit double digits.

Interesting mention on a recent Meat Eater podcast by a deer biologist who found it utterly laughable that guys thought they could age a deer by looking at its body or its antlers. Apparently it's actually been studied and nobody is better than random chance. Tooth age is the only reliable way to go after they're past spikes.

I'm just going by a couple of bucks I've observed over the years. One I saw every year as a 2pt, ended up getting that one on the eleventh year, meat was tough as leather and had no teeth but otherwise still seemed healthy enough to live a couple more years. The other a 4pt I've seen every year for 13 which makes me believe he's 16+ years.

[lokidog]

One thing I might add is don’t assume because a buck is only a 2x2 that he isn’t mature. Especially if you end up out on the coast or up the peninsula, a fair amount of bucks out in that neck of the woods never make it past a 2 point no matter the age.

Or the islands....

[jamesfromseattle]

One thing I might add is don’t assume because a buck is only a 2x2 that he isn’t mature. Especially if you end up out on the coast or up the peninsula, a fair amount of bucks out in that neck of the woods never make it past a 2 point no matter the age.

Or the islands....

Anecdotal knowledge at best, but my guess is that on Orcas the norm is for bucks to max out at 2x2 without eyeguards. Then they tend to just get more mass as they age. I’m guessing you’ve got similar genetics down on Decatur.

[fishnfur]

Which makes ya wonder how old bucks really get? Studies claim I think 10-12 years tops. But I bet it's twice that if conditions are favorable and predators are low.

No I think that's wrong. Virtually everywhere a 10+ male deer is absolutely ancient. Does live a lot longer than bucks, but very, VERY few bucks hit double digits.

Interesting mention on a recent Meat Eater podcast by a deer biologist who found it utterly laughable that guys thought they could age a deer by looking at its body or its antlers. Apparently it's actually been studied and nobody is better than random chance. Tooth age is the only reliable way to go after they're past spikes.

I'm just going by a couple of bucks I've observed over the years. One I saw every year as a 2pt, ended up getting that one on the eleventh year, meat was tough as leather and had no teeth but otherwise still seemed healthy enough to live a couple more years. The other a 4pt I've seen every year for 13 which makes me believe he's 16+ years.

Man, I love this stuff!  Captivity studies have does maxing out around 16 years.  Could a buck live that long - absolutely, but probably not more than one in a hundred thousand or so. Perhaps half that.  Who knows, it's not very many.  Griiz either has the WA BT deer bulletin/book or posted one of my earlier scans regarding antlers.  I believe that book has age range for bucks in captivity.  I'm not going to hazard a guess and it's getting near midnight, when I'd rather guess than research.  Twelve may be the average max age for wild bucks (from memory (Which ain't that hot anymore))., but there are always outliers.

You are all aware that the negative effects of rutting on a buck is a major limiting factor in the age a buck may achieve once it has survived the first few years of life.  Hunters and other predators start picking 'em off once they get slow, injured, or sick.  Immune systems are similar to all other animals, and past the age of nine or ten, they are truly getting into geriatrics, when it doesn't take a heck of a lot to turn a healthy animal into a dying one.  They tend to age a lot like dogs, and I've yet to have a dog make thirteen years (though I have a 12.5 currently).  Every once in awhile, you see a dog get past fifteen though.

I believe (right or wrong) that you can absolutely age a blacktail buck up to age 4.5 on body characteristics alone.  Past that point, best guessing is based on a combination of body mass, antler mass/knurling, shape of the nose and size of the eye in relation to the head, regressive appearance of tines, etc..  While virtually all old bucks display a white muzzle, it turned out that this characteristic is not enough evidence on which to base the age of a buck prior to committing to a shot.    Some younger BT bucks have very white muzzles.