POLL: Deer Herd Decline, Why?

[Mudman]

After this winter I don't think things will improve?

[bearpaw]

After this winter I don't think things will improve?

I know its being tough on the wetside, but in the NE on an overall basis we've had a mild winter until this last week, which is actually more normal winter weather. What really makes a difference is what happens in March and April! Fingers crossed!

[huntnnw]

the worst is heavy snow at tail end of rut. It usually kills off a lot of bucks. This year was extremely mild all the way thru Jan

[Skyvalhunter]

I don't agree with the habitat loss theory in the areas I hunt. The Methow, Chiwawa, Mission really haven't had habitat loss. There have been significant fires in the Methow but much of that area came back strong the next year and it wasn't like deer were starving they were over harvested due to poor WDFW management.

[Roperfive88]

I had a guy that said he helped with a mule deer study in washington and he said a big percentage of fawns were killed by bobcats.

[MtnMuley]

How can you make a poll with 12 choices, but leave off the list the most important choice, MISMANAGEMENT?

Mismanagement is a combination of several of the choices. IMO

Sure looks to me like many of the members are saying mismanagement, but hey, this is your big poll, so be stubborn. I could care less.

[nwwanderer]

Raising critters, the state owns them all, is a complicated process.  Always a new challenge.  Use this winter storm as an example with the Yakima valley dairies as the example, couple a thousand cows dead, ten of thousands effected with a multi-year affect.  With my local whitetail the fawn crop has been really bad for several years, no research or explanation for why from WDFW.  You can be assured the dairymen are making changes and solving problems, not so much with the deer.  Bottom line: No way to pick one cause and ignoring a problem does not solve it.

[idahohuntr]

How can you make a poll with 12 choices, but leave off the list the most important choice, MISMANAGEMENT?

Mismanagement is a combination of several of the choices. IMO

Sure looks to me like many of the members are saying mismanagement, but hey, this is your big poll, so be stubborn. I could care less.

There is an "other" category - and folks can then explain what their observations are.  Just saying "mismanagement" is about the most useless thing one could select if there is not a more elaborate description of what that means.   

[Rainier10]

How can you make a poll with 12 choices, but leave off the list the most important choice, MISMANAGEMENT?

Mismanagement is a combination of several of the choices. IMO

Sure looks to me like many of the members are saying mismanagement, but hey, this is your big poll, so be stubborn. I could care less.

Seems to me "mismanagement" is a pretty broad term and the options he has given are very specific.

Would you say that too many cougars is mismanagement?  Overharvest is mismanagement?  Uncontrolled wolves is mismanagement?  Not enough enforcement to stop poaching is mismanagement?  Legal harvest is mismanagement?  Not buying enough habitat is mismanagement?

I would say all of those options could fall under "mismanagement". 

He did give the option of "other... do tell".

It would certainly be nice to know what your definition of "mismanagement" is.  Seems pretty broad to me and could mean different things to everyone.

I believe the question by the OP was to choose one reason that was creating the decline in the deer herd.

The question wasn't "pick one word that covers the most options on my list".

[NOCK NOCK]

How can you make a poll with 12 choices, but leave off the list the most important choice, MISMANAGEMENT?

Mismanagement is a combination of several of the choices. IMO

Sure looks to me like many of the members are saying mismanagement, but hey, this is your big poll, so be stubborn. I could care less.

You are correct, It is my poll, and has provided some great discussion. If you don't like it you are welcome to not partake. 

[hunter399]

I won't vote in your poll.
Should be all of the above option.
The definition of mismanagement is having seasonal surplus animals for us hunters to hunt.
If you don't have surplus animals every year then you have declines in herds it's not rocket science.Then you have hunters that don't want any change in seasons ect. Without scientific data to support it.But WDFW drags there feet so much on there studies ,herd counts ,all that .That many years of damage to herds have been done .We go from having good deer seasons to very limited hunting opportunity makes hunters mad.What's happening out in the woods and what's on paper is not always the same.

[rainshadow1]

I took a hunter's safety class with my stepkids a year and a half ago. (And with my two sons about 6 years ago. And on my own 35 years ago... yeesh!) Anyway, the WDFW is requiring the instructors to tell the classes that predators aren't able to make a significant impact on the prey species populations.



. . . . . . . . . . THINK ABOUT THAT . . . . . . . . . .




None of the instructors agreed with it, I talked to them, but the wdfw REQUIRED them to teach it that way.


More here than meets the eye, folks.

[gaddy]

I went with over harvest in general. In my mind this includes ALL the predators, poachers and legal hunting combined. Predators are still going eat x amount, poachers are going to poach and hunters will hunt if able. Hard to imagine a herd bouncing back with all that pressure once their numbers drop due to what ever reason.

[idahohuntr]

I took a hunter's safety class with my stepkids a year and a half ago. (And with my two sons about 6 years ago. And on my own 35 years ago... yeesh!) Anyway, the WDFW is requiring the instructors to tell the classes that predators aren't able to make a significant impact on the prey species populations.



. . . . . . . . . . THINK ABOUT THAT . . . . . . . . . .




None of the instructors agreed with it, I talked to them, but the wdfw REQUIRED them to teach it that way.


More here than meets the eye, folks.

Can you provide some documentation and context to this?  I don't believe what you are describing is possibly accurate and/or complete...effects of predators on wildlife has been studied for centuries, and while its by no means always the cause of declines there are several studies where it is...so I think the instructors probably misunderstood something. 

[Rainier10]

I took a hunter's safety class with my stepkids a year and a half ago. (And with my two sons about 6 years ago. And on my own 35 years ago... yeesh!) Anyway, the WDFW is requiring the instructors to tell the classes that predators aren't able to make a significant impact on the prey species populations.



. . . . . . . . . . THINK ABOUT THAT . . . . . . . . . .




None of the instructors agreed with it, I talked to them, but the wdfw REQUIRED them to teach it that way.


More here than meets the eye, folks.

Can you provide some documentation and context to this?  I don't believe what you are describing is possibly accurate and/or complete...effects of predators on wildlife has been studied for centuries, and while its by no means always the cause of declines there are several studies where it is...so I think the instructors probably misunderstood something.

I would love to hear more about this "requirement".  I teach hunter ed and I have not been given the direction you are describing.  We use the water bucket pic in Hunter399's post.  The bucket is the "carrying capacity" of the land.  All of the holes are things that lower population.  Predators and hunters create one of those holes that affect population and keep it below capacity.  If you are over capacity you damage the habitat.