CVA or Knight for hunting elk in western Washington

[Mike171]

I'm looking to buy my first muzzleloader for hunting elk in western Washington and hoping to get some recommendations on which one to get based off the experience of others. A friend recommended I purchase a Knight Ultra-Lite online. I went to a local muzzleloader shop in hopes of getting to put my hands on one only to find out they don't carry them. The shop owner there said that Knights are pretty much obsolete and that they haven't produced anything new in about 4 years. He showed me the CVA's he carries and said that they were cutting edge, very accurate, easy to clean, and just very user friendly overall. As a long time muzzleloader, he says that is what he uses and recommends. He seemed sincere but I also have to wonder if he is just trying to make a sale. I am trying to decide between the Paramount, Accura MRX, and the Ultra-Lite. I really like how easily the MRX breaks down but I'm not sure about having to carry the collapsible ramrod as opposed to it stowing away in the stock. And I would need to purchase a separate one for cleaning. Any input from others who have experience with these would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

[duckmen1]

I think I know the shop you are referring too. I personally like knight muzzleloaders. Sportsman’s warehouse would be another place to see if they are in stock. If the shop you are referring to is “ along a river” that is currently being talked about on this site right now for salmon. I would say I don’t care for the place. Primarily due to the stuck up attitude I have gotten from the owner many times over the years. When trying to get certain bullets and such I would get attitude due to not wanting to buy his power belts for many reasons, and he gave me a lot of crap over a lot of different things. He goes around to all the stores in town and buys out all the shipments of musket caps and then doubles to triples the cost on them. He definetely down talked knights all the time to me primarily due to being a cva dealer. Knights have a good reputation here but what ever you decide to get enjoy the heck out of it. Muzzleloading is a lot of fun.

[10thmountainarcher]

I'm looking to buy my first muzzleloader for hunting elk in western Washington and hoping to get some recommendations on which one to get based off the experience of others. A friend recommended I purchase a Knight Ultra-Lite online. I went to a local muzzleloader shop in hopes of getting to put my hands on one only to find out they don't carry them. The shop owner there said that Knights are pretty much obsolete and that they haven't produced anything new in about 4 years. He showed me the CVA's he carries and said that they were cutting edge, very accurate, easy to clean, and just very user friendly overall. As a long time muzzleloader, he says that is what he uses and recommends. He seemed sincere but I also have to wonder if he is just trying to make a sale. I am trying to decide between the Paramount, Accura MRX, and the Ultra-Lite. I really like how easily the MRX breaks down but I'm not sure about having to carry the collapsible ramrod as opposed to it stowing away in the stock. And I would need to purchase a separate one for cleaning. Any input from others who have experience with these would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

The paramount can be hard to find due to not being produced at the moment. Black Horn 209 availability is why CVA put a freeze on em.

[JakeLand]

Knight ultra lite is my go to first every day and a knight disc extreme is a close second . You won’t ever be disappointed with either one and knight production has not stopped

[Karl Blanchard]

Do a little research on CVA and you will find endless QC issues. I recently purchased an accura lrx and it was a complete lemon. Sent it back to CVA and they concurred.  Only problem is none of the lrx's they had to replace it could pass their accuracy testing so all I got was a refund.

Been a knight guy for years but the slick lrx was too tempting. Lesson learned, back to knight I will go.

[Gettin Birdie]

Knight is far from obsolete.  I bought two disc extremes while living in WA, based on recommendations from my boss when I wanted to get into muzzy, he had a bighorn, I couldn't find them at the time.  I read Sabotloader"s posts from here and elsewhere and every question I had was answered by his expertise and field time with knights, so no hiccups from store to first deer.  Buy & you won't be disappointed, great accuracy too. 

[mossback91]

Love my knight disc extreme and bighorn but I don’t have much experience with CVA besides shooting one a few times.

[raydog]

I've used CVA for about 6 years before switching to a knight mountaineer. The CVA did the job just fine, killed 3 bulls with CVA, but the knight is a better gun. The cva will be more field cleaning friendly. But I have a little field kit I built for my knight so I'm good to go

[high_hunter]

I'm not very familiar with the current CVAs but my vote goes to knight as well.  Bighorn and littlehorn have been trouble free as long as you clean and maintenance them.

[lazydrifter]

My boys and I hunt Western Washington for elk.  We all use knight.  Most accurate muzzleloaders I've ever shot. If I was looking I would buy that .52 disc extreme Knight has on sale.  Get it in the 209 primer.  399.00 to your door right now.

[jrebel]

I own two CVA’s….the first one shoots great!!!   The other, I will update in a week or so as I just got it put together.   I imagine it will shoot equally as good.   

Curious what problems people have had with their CVA’s and if the problems were befor they went to Berara barrels.  Ming go bang and are as accurate as any other open site rifle I own.   

Here is the new one. 

[Cougartail]

I have a Traditions Prusuit G4.

It goes bang and cleans up nice.

So far I can get a 12" group at 30 yards.

I'm  stoked!!!!!

[PsoasHunter]

I bought a new CVA Optima a number of years ago.  The selling points were it was easy to clean and cheaper than the knight bighorn I was also looking at.  It failed to ignite the powder 8 times out of 10 the first time I took it to the range, using musket RWS musket caps (before 209 was legal). I traded it for the knight bighorn, which has never mis-fired on me and has killed. a number of elk now. The knights are top of the line in my opinion and worth the extra cost.  Yeah it's harder to clean, but that doesn't matter once your elk is on the ground.

[ctwiggs1]

My Bighorn is quite accurate. I’ve been really happy with it for the last 10 years or so.  Many elk and deer tags have been notched with that thing!  I’ve had one issue ever and the GM of Knight called me and walked me through the issue (it was my fault).

Great company and great product.

I can’t speak to CVA but I’ve heard good things.

[knighttime25]

I have a Traditions Prusuit G4.

It goes bang and cleans up nice.

So far I can get a 12" group at 30 yards.

I'm  stoked!!!!!

12" group at 30 yards!??! 

[hunter_sean08]

I actually just received my Ultra-Lite yesterday and am excited to get out and shoot it this weekend. I first got to hold one out in the field elk hunting last year when I ran into another hunter who was carrying one. When I asked him how he liked his, he said in all his years hunting elk with a muzzleloader, no other gun he had used could compare. I was super impressed with not just the gun’s weight, but its overall balance and feel. I could also tell that it was made with high quality components. After taking my own gun out of the box almost a year later, I’m happy to report I still feel the quality workmanship and balance in this gun. The “Made in USA” stamp on the barrel makes you proud to own one as well. And with the full plastic jacket 209 primer system, I know I’m getting something relatively failsafe for rainy conditions in Western Washington.

As for Knight’s track record, my hunting partners both carry Knight Bighorns and neither one of them have had any issues since they bought them nearly 10 years ago. Knight makes a great muzzleloader, period.

[ctwiggs1]

I have a Traditions Prusuit G4.

It goes bang and cleans up nice.

So far I can get a 12" group at 30 yards.

I'm  stoked!!!!!

 

[Cougartail]

I have a Traditions Prusuit G4.

It goes bang and cleans up nice.

So far I can get a 12" group at 30 yards.

I'm  stoked!!!!!

 

Yes, it's  quite a group!

[HntnFsh]

Try a rest. Might be able to get those groups down to 10"

[Karl Blanchard]

I own two CVA’s….the first one shoots great!!!   The other, I will update in a week or so as I just got it put together.   I imagine it will shoot equally as good.   

Curious what problems people have had with their CVA’s and if the problems were befor they went to Berara barrels.  Ming go bang and are as accurate as any other open site rifle I own.   

Here is the new one.

Like I said before, I just bought mine so it had a Bergara barrel, as well as the ones they attempted to replace it with. I can't speak to the one's they tested for my replacement but they stated they didn't pass accuracy standards.

Mine had an INCREDIBLY loose bore. I still gave it an honest try though. I burned a pound of blackhorn209 and 5 different bullets.  Even with the NXS on there best group I got was a 4" 5 shot group that was not repeatable. Most groups were 5"+.

Another major issue was blow back out of the breechplug. 2 different breech plugs actually as I bought a second to try and rectify the issue. Primers were extremely loose in both resulting in tons of blowback into the receiver as well as out into the scope tube and my face. There was actually so much blowback that it was fouling the trigger assembly to the point where after 3 or so shots the hammer wouldn't cock or would only partially engage resulting in an unsafe trigger that took mere ounces to fire or a simple tap on the gun to slam fire.

CVA customer service was top notch and great to work with but at the end of the day I was left with no new muzzy and out a lot of components.

[jrebel]

I own two CVA’s….the first one shoots great!!!   The other, I will update in a week or so as I just got it put together.   I imagine it will shoot equally as good.   

Curious what problems people have had with their CVA’s and if the problems were befor they went to Berara barrels.  Ming go bang and are as accurate as any other open site rifle I own.   

Here is the new one.

Like I said before, I just bought mine so it had a Bergara barrel, as well as the ones they attempted to replace it with. I can't speak to the one's they tested for my replacement but they stated they didn't pass accuracy standards.

Mine had an INCREDIBLY loose bore. I still gave it an honest try though. I burned a pound of blackhorn209 and 5 different bullets.  Even with the NXS on there best group I got was a 4" 5 shot group that was not repeatable. Most groups were 5"+.

Another major issue was blow back out of the breechplug. 2 different breech plugs actually as I bought a second to try and rectify the issue. Primers were extremely loose in both resulting in tons of blowback into the receiver as well as out into the scope tube and my face. There was actually so much blowback that it was fouling the trigger assembly to the point where after 3 or so shots the hammer wouldn't cock or wouldn't only partially engage resulting in an unsafe trigger that took mere ounces to fire or a simple tap on the gun to slam fire.

CVA customer service was top notch and great to work with but at the end of the day I was left with no new muzzy and out a lot of components.

Fingers crossed my new one does not have this issue.  I will report back after I get to the range. 

[Karl Blanchard]

Yeah hope yours is trouble free. I forgot to mention this was a .45 cal not a 50 cal. My nephew has a 50 he got for Christmas and it shoots fine. If you have good accuracy but getting blowback this is supposed to be the best fix and since you're a reloader and I assume you've got a decent supply of rifle primers, this is a great option. I was gonna get one but accuracy was so bad I didn't want to dump more money into it.

https://arrowheadrifles.com/product/cva_qrbp/

[Threewolves]

I hunted with the CVA optima V2 I borrowed last year the thing shot fantastic. I was hitting dead on at 150 yds. I ran across a guy that said I should get the CVA acura because he said it was better. If I was buying I would just get the optima and put the peep site towards the back like my the one that I borrowed. 5cents

[jrebel]

I don't get any blow back in my optima....and it uses the same breach plug, so I can't imagine it will be an issue.  Were you shooting the blackhorn breach plug or the original / standard?  I bought two extra blackhorn breach plugs for the two muzzy's so I hope it works.  Worst case scenario, I could always shoot the original breach plug with pyrodex.  Both of mine are 50 cal so fingers crossed. 

[Cougartail]

Try a rest. Might be able to get those groups down to 10"

That was bench rested! 

I'm not the only one with issues with the G4.

I'm  going to do some more work this weekend.

[Karl Blanchard]

I don't get any blow back in my optima....and it uses the same breach plug, so I can't imagine it will be an issue.  Were you shooting the blackhorn breach plug or the original / standard?  I bought two extra blackhorn breach plugs for the two muzzy's so I hope it works.  Worst case scenario, I could always shoot the original breach plug with pyrodex.  Both of mine are 50 cal so fingers crossed.

yes Blackhorn breech plug.  You shouldn't be getting any blowback.

[Tenkara]

I have two bighorns, one I've been using for ten plus years and is accurate and reliable. The second one is new and unfired, and I only bought it because knight was selling them super cheap, but I have no reason to try anything else. I'm using 100gr of 777 fff and 300gr sst's with a musket cap and it shoots really well.

[BigVinn]

I started with an mk85, then a disc extreme and now an ultralight. They have all shot fantastic. The ultralite is spendy but the older I get the more I like the light weight when I’m in the woods lol 

[jrebel]

Well, so far so good.  I will start another post so I am not muddying this one, but the Acura LR-X 50 cal shot good today. 

[jamese]

100% what lazy drifter said -" get the "Knight .52.. on sale".

[Buster Brown]

Have both.

Knight Ultralight Feels like a much higher quality gun.  But it’s not twice as good, for being more than twice the price than the Optima.  Breech plug is much harder to remove than CVA (you need to pull out a very small spring plunger while rotating the breech unloading rod/tool.  The Knight is extremely watertight, using number 11 caps.  Cleaning one vs the other is difficult in different ways.  Once you’ve fully disassembled the Knight, it cleans easily.  The CVA breech comes out easy, but getting the firing pin and trigger assembly clean is, at least for me, sluice it out, spray out moisture with compressed air, spray some lube in, and hope no rust develops.

Both are equally accurate for me with iron sights; never scoped either.

That’s been my experience.
To sum up: Knight Ultralight is much nicer, but CVA Optima is more than good enough, and a much better value.

[JakeLand]

Have both.

Knight Ultralight Feels like a much higher quality gun.  But it’s not twice as good, for being more than twice the price than the Optima.  Breech plug is much harder to remove than CVA (you need to pull out a very small spring plunger while rotating the breech unloading rod/tool.  The Knight is extremely watertight, using number 11 caps.  Cleaning one vs the other is difficult in different ways.  Once you’ve fully disassembled the Knight, it cleans easily.  The CVA breech comes out easy, but getting the firing pin and trigger assembly clean is, at least for me, sluice it out, spray out moisture with compressed air, spray some lube in, and hope no rust develops.

Both are equally accurate for me with iron sights; never scoped either.

That’s been my experience.
To sum up: Knight Ultralight is much nicer, but CVA Optima is more than good enough, and a much better value.

if taking the bolt out ( 2 seconds) and putting a breach plug wrench in and loosening the breech plug (15 seconds total ) is totally disassembling the knight to clean then ok

[riverrun]

I have several muzzleloaders and by far my favorite is the CVA Accura V2!

[M_ray]

Short answer Knight,

A couple buddies had problems with CVA and customer service didn’t seem much into sorting them out. I personally shoot TC but everyone I know that shoot knight never have issues and they are great. I’ve shot them at the range they are accurate.

[WSU]

My cva wouldn’t fire consistently.  Cost me two bulls, one of which was a really nice bull on a draw tag. The convenience and accuracy aren’t worth much when your watch a big bull trot off because the gun didn’t work.