.270 vs 338

[bobcat]

Yes, There is such a thing as over kill. I've seen some deer shot ,once in the shoulder, with 30-06's that where only good for burger, and noting else. The only time I've had that happen with my .270, I shot the poor thing 5 times thinking I was missing. and not wanting it to go dawn that steep hill.

A 30-06 will do no more damage to meat than a 270. They are virtually the same as far as that aspect goes. It's the type of bullet used that really makes a difference.

Both guns where shooting Cor-Loks, The 30-06 was maybe 20 yrds close. We had to take the whole left shoulder off, it was totally blood shot and bruised. The 270 broke the shoulder, but very little meat was lost. The 30-06 is a great gun and yes it is similar to the 270. but most guys shoot 150 grain bullits, very few try to find or want to pay for smaller rounds. I'm not picking on 30-06, my point is if a 30-06 would do that, then 338 would too. If you don't care all that much for the meat, then fine. I like the meat, so for deer sized animals I would opt for my 270 over my 300. For bigger animals I would opt for the 300. Just my opinion.

Again, it's not the caliber that causes excessive meat damage, it's the speed of the bullet and the type of bullet. A heavier bullet will be easier on the meat, in general. Main reason for that being that a heavier bullet will be moving at a lower speed than a lighter bullet.

Yes Bullet design has a lot to do with it. But you been smoking some thing, Heavier, larger bullets do more damage than lighter smaller. Speed has some effect, and what that is again depends on bullet design.

No, I think you've been eating some special mushrooms. If the weight of a bullet is such a determining factor in how much meat is ruined, why is it that I can shoot a deer with my 54 caliber muzzleloader and a 435 grain bullet, directly in the shoulder, and have virtually no meat loss, while the same shot with a 130 grain bullet out of a 270 Winchester will ruin BOTH shoulders?

[WDFW-SUX]

 

[Skillet]

Seems like if you already have a 300 RUM and are looking for another gun, a 25-06 is what you should be looking at instead of a 270.  With the premium 308 bullets now out there, the 300 pretty much takes care of anything you want to do on heavy game at long ranges.  A good 25-06 can fill the gap on down to coyotes.

[300UltraMagShooter]

I've seen tests that show bullet speed is more important to tissue distruction than is bullet mass.

Having said that, that should not apply here since my 300 rum will be traveling at least as fast as a 270 at a heavier bullet weight (more energy).

I would imagine that bullet construction would be the most important aspect of dispursing that energy.    Harder/non-mushrooming bullet would dispurse less energy thus less tissue distruction.  

I guess the next test would be to shoot big game through shoulders and non-idea spots to see which works best?  I'd imagine that a bigger (heavier/denser) bullet would have a penetration advantage, but how much and would it be enough to justify a big cal such as the 338?

[yorketransport]

I guess the next test would be to shoot big game through shoulders and non-idea spots to see which works best?  I'd imagine that a bigger (heavier/denser) bullet would have a penetration advantage, but how much and would it be enough to justify a big cal such as the 338?

It's funny to hear a guy with a 300 Ultra call a 338 a big cailber. 

You should be able to push a 220gr Partition to an easy 2800fps from you 300. You might be able to move a 225 Partition that fast out of a 338 Win Mag, but a 220gr 30cal will have a higher SD and theoretically have better penetration.

I'll help you out. Sell me your 300 Ultra, then you can just buy a 270 and a 338. Problem solved!

Andrew

[1bugman]

Yes, There is such a thing as over kill. I've seen some deer shot ,once in the shoulder, with 30-06's that where only good for burger, and noting else. The only time I've had that happen with my .270, I shot the poor thing 5 times thinking I was missing. and not wanting it to go dawn that steep hill.

A 30-06 will do no more damage to meat than a 270. They are virtually the same as far as that aspect goes. It's the type of bullet used that really makes a difference.

Both guns where shooting Cor-Loks, The 30-06 was maybe 20 yrds close. We had to take the whole left shoulder off, it was totally blood shot and bruised. The 270 broke the shoulder, but very little meat was lost. The 30-06 is a great gun and yes it is similar to the 270. but most guys shoot 150 grain bullits, very few try to find or want to pay for smaller rounds. I'm not picking on 30-06, my point is if a 30-06 would do that, then 338 would too. If you don't care all that much for the meat, then fine. I like the meat, so for deer sized animals I would opt for my 270 over my 300. For bigger animals I would opt for the 300. Just my opinion.

Again, it's not the caliber that causes excessive meat damage, it's the speed of the bullet and the type of bullet. A heavier bullet will be easier on the meat, in general. Main reason for that being that a heavier bullet will be moving at a lower speed than a lighter bullet.

Yes Bullet design has a lot to do with it. But you been smoking some thing, Heavier, larger bullets do more damage than lighter smaller. Speed has some effect, and what that is again depends on bullet design.

No, I think you've been eating some special mushrooms. If the weight of a bullet is such a determining factor in how much meat is ruined, why is it that I can shoot a deer with my 54 caliber muzzleloader and a 435 grain bullet, directly in the shoulder, and have virtually no meat loss, while the same shot with a 130 grain bullet out of a 270 Winchester will ruin BOTH shoulders?

http://www.hornady.com/ballistics-resource/terminal


"The primary way a bullet causes damage to an animal is through the permanent cavity it leaves - the hole that is created as the bullet passes through skin, bone or flesh. "

[300UltraMagShooter]

Caliber speaks to the size of the bullet's diameter, so a .338 is bigger. 

The entire question really is, "does size matter"?   

In all seriousness, I'm still now sure.

I guess the next test would be to shoot big game through shoulders and non-idea spots to see which works best?  I'd imagine that a bigger (heavier/denser) bullet would have a penetration advantage, but how much and would it be enough to justify a big cal such as the 338?

It's funny to hear a guy with a 300 Ultra call a 338 a big cailber. 

You should be able to push a 220gr Partition to an easy 2800fps from you 300. You might be able to move a 225 Partition that fast out of a 338 Win Mag, but a 220gr 30cal will have a higher SD and theoretically have better penetration.

I'll help you out. Sell me your 300 Ultra, then you can just buy a 270 and a 338. Problem solved!

Andrew

[1bugman]

Sorry for jacking your thread and not being much help, but boocat had me going.


http://www.angelfire.com/art/enchanter/terminal.html

"Physical Damage/Wound channel. As well as penetrating deep enough, an effective bullet will also make as wide a wound channel as is possible. This facilitates rapid blood loss. Wound channel size is increased by bullet size, tumbling, mushrooming and bullet shape –a round nosed bullet tends to push flesh aside while a flat faced one crushes what is ahead of it, creating a more open channel. This channel caused by the bullet's path is called the permanent cavity."

 "Also, it is not how much energy the bullet has at the muzzle but how much it has at the target that is important. The same property that lets a light bullet be accelerated more readily (low inertia) also means that it can be more easily slowed by the air it is passing through. Most handgun fights take place at less than 6 metres, and light high velocity rounds are intended to give the best performance within this range. However, shots at longer ranges are by no means exceptional, and at these ranges lightweights often lack sufficient target effect."

[Buckmark]

Get a .270 weatherby, there the velocity guys are happy, the .270 guys are happy, you already have a big 30 so problem solved...

[FC]

[Jamieb]

I've played with both more then a little and my all around hunting rifle is a 7 rem mag. The 7 mag will hang pretty well with the 300RUM at long range but with a whole lot less recoil.