The bull that wouldn't fight

[SteelheadTed]

My season was a success despite not shooting a bull.  I hunted for 7 days, 4 with my oldest daughter and it was great getting out there with her.  This was our first year archery hunting (I've rifle hunted 4 seasons up this one).  My goal was to have a chance at a bull and we got one. 

After a discouraging 2.5 days of calling elk and not getting responses across 10-15 square miles we finally got a response on the third day (and not coincidentally it was after we found some really good sign).  We couldn't close the gap the first day but found them again the next day.  A bull with some cows.  The bull responded to every call with a chuckle.  My bugle is good but my chuckle needs work so I never responded with a chuckle, just bugles and cow calls.  We realized as we approached that the herd was moving away from us, not fast, like they winded us, but moving away.  We watched our wind close.

We had an opportunity to cut them off as they came down perpendicular to a finger ridge.  We just missed them on the cutoff and they were on their way up the other side of an adjacent ridge by the time we got there.  Again, not moving fast, but moving.  I bugled and got the bull to stop and for the first time he full bugled back.  I couldn't see him well due to brush but he was a good sized bull but not a giant.  I wasn't able to count points, too many branches and he was still 100 yards off.  He kept moving over the ridge, chuckling, but not stopping.  That was the last we saw of him.  We weren't able to relocate them again, I think they moved onto some private timber land

We learned a ton and I think for elk, I am now an archery guy.  Hearing them bugle back and getting close is an experience that can't be matched outside of the rut.

So, we are struggling to figure out what else we could have done.  Is it as simple as chuckling back?  Might he have turned and fought?  My bugles are high pitched, full-throated affairs.  Could it be he thought I was the bigger bull and didn't want to fight?

Thanks.

[WSU]

It sounds like you need to get in a lot closer before you bugle.  Inside 100 yards or even less.

[huntnfmly]

Sounds like a great time with your daughter to me that trip was a success.Being able to find and interact with the herd and bull.
Imo throwing out full blown bugles
Will sometime make the bull just gather  up his cows and leave not wanting to deal with another bull that sounds might be bigger.
 I learned that the hard way one time on my first elk hunt as started off right at daylight with a locating bugle I got a response and then I stepped it up thinking that's what you're suppose to do.I got a few bugles back but noticed they were getting farther away then I watched the herd bull pushing his cows in front of him through the saddle lessons learned

[boneaddict]

Every situation needs to be treated different.   Id recommend Elknuts CDset. He is a sponsor here.    It will go over exactly what you did here and what you should have done.   I just saw this morning that they nailed a big ole bull. 

[huntnfmly]

Every situation needs to be treated different.   Id recommend Elknuts CDset. He is a sponsor here.    It will go over exactly what you did here and what you should have done.   I just saw this morning that they nailed a big ole bull. 

I got 1 of Pauls package deals with CD and playbook and learned a great deal and he'll talk your ear off with great information if you call him and ask

[TikkaT3-270Shortmag]

Sounds like it was a herd bull that rounded up his ladies and was out of there.  Sometimes it's hard cause u wanna bugle to locate them.  Gotta get into the kitchen!

[buggy]

A herd bull with cows (especially a hot cow) is extremely difficult to call in. You'll almost always have to go to him.

[bwhntr350]

Not trying to beat a dead horse but I think many here nailed it. It took me quite a few years to realize that just shutting up is the way to go. I hardly hunt, anymore. Still got a lot of life left and I can get around at 54 years of age with most anyone, but I don't have the desire to kill more elk. I have a number of good ones and that's enough...for now.

When I do hunt, my tactics are this:  I rarely bugle. Maybe three times a day just to locate. If I locate I am 100 percent quiet from there on in and try to get a sneak on. If I have to locate again because I could not find the elk or tracks, then it is only by cow calling. 100 percent of everytime that I have bugled to a herd bull he just pushes the herd away. May get lucky and have a satellite come in but that does me no good. I want the herd bull or no bull. I've gotten into the middle of a herd with a massive 7X8 and the cows were on to me and I was in between the bull and the cows that spied me and thought I only had one chance, at that point. I grab a stick and bugled while trotting up to a small tree and started beating the tree up, scraping and rubbing it. The bull, conveniently, walked up and around me crossing the hill right above me at about 30 or 35 yards. I grunted, hoping, but he did not stop. It was a wide open shot, steep uphill, but I was not taking the shot unless he stopped. He did not stop and I never seen him again.

After locating and trying to set up a stalk, too me, there is only one way and that is alone. I will not hunt with anyone because I believe that there are just too many eyes and ears there for two people to get close. Not saying it cannot happen, just saying that the odds are, exponentially,  better if you are alone.

Even though I've taken my fair share of record book bulls, there will be others that, most certainly, disagree with me. I'm sure things are different, better buglers, etc., but for me, these are my rules.

The best thing for you and your daughter is time in the woods, experience. You will, eventually, figure out what works (nothing works 100% of the time) and what does not work. One thing you could try is heading somewhere, after the early archery season, that has lot's of rutting bulls. All my hunting is on the O.P. so, naturally, the Olympic National Park is a great place to gain some experience, for me. Pick a river drainage, Quinault, Queets, Hoh, Bogachiel, pack a day pack and go hike 10 or 15 miles up a trail. You'll find elk. Try some things out. If nothing else, you'll have a great time!

EDIT: Although, I stated that I will rarely bugle when locating elk, I will use a cow call, a lot. Failed to mention that. The timing of the early archery season is a tad early, usually, for major rutting activity. imo. Although, there should be big bulls joined up with the herds, by then, no doubt, there is still a very good chance of finding a great bull who is still looking for some girls. These bulls are super easy to cow call in, and even bugle in, and there is no question that one of them may be a huge bull. So, for that reason, the evolution of my early archery hunting has turned towards that strategy of using a cow call more than bugling.

[Hot Lunch]

Sounds about like my elk calling experience. I will cow call my way in, but rarely bugle other than locating. Get sneaky and stalk them once you locate.

[coachcw]

I'm the opposite . I used to try and spot stalj and sneak in. Screw that I make all kind of noise breaking branches cow calking rolling rocks Glu king and bugling when the time is right.  One rule always keep your wind . Cut the distance fast . If it's a herd bull that I know has calls I will close the gap fast and try cow calling when inside of 200 . If he would t come litterly run in and challenge him . Offte. We do this with two or three guys . That's what makes it do fun . It's about the experience . Spot and stalj is fine for the late season but in September it's on ! Next year bullbaster and I are gonna pull a next level trick . Can't wait to try it stay tuned ! Enjoy your hunts and learn from them hunting with good friends and family is where it's at . Have fun with it.

[SteelheadTed]

Thanks all for the responses.  I can’t wait for next season to apply what we learned this year.

bwhntr350, thanks for your response, I may just go out there this weekend and see what else we can learn without a bow in our hands.

[lokidog]

Most people need to sound like a smaller bull, they push the herd boys away.   

[TheHunt]

September elk hunt is crazy amount of fun.  Many have said this but Coach is on target.  Move fast to the bull.  Don't worry about making noise.  If you bump his cows.  Bugle ASAP.  This will make the situation that another bull was trying to get his cows. He will typically come in looking to kick your butt.  Also sound like a smaller bull high pitch.  So he is not afraid to come kick your butt. 

[branches]

Not trying to beat a dead horse but I think many here nailed it. It took me quite a few years to realize that just shutting up is the way to go. I hardly hunt, anymore. Still got a lot of life left and I can get around at 54 years of age with most anyone, but I don't have the desire to kill more elk. I have a number of good ones and that's enough...for now.

When I do hunt, my tactics are this:  I rarely bugle. Maybe three times a day just to locate. If I locate I am 100 percent quiet from there on in and try to get a sneak on. If I have to locate again because I could not find the elk or tracks, then it is only by cow calling. 100 percent of everytime that I have bugled to a herd bull he just pushes the herd away. May get lucky and have a satellite come in but that does me no good. I want the herd bull or no bull. I've gotten into the middle of a herd with a massive 7X8 and the cows were on to me and I was in between the bull and the cows that spied me and thought I only had one chance, at that point. I grab a stick and bugled while trotting up to a small tree and started beating the tree up, scraping and rubbing it. The bull, conveniently, walked up and around me crossing the hill right above me at about 30 or 35 yards. I grunted, hoping, but he did not stop. It was a wide open shot, steep uphill, but I was not taking the shot unless he stopped. He did not stop and I never seen him again.

After locating and trying to set up a stalk, too me, there is only one way and that is alone. I will not hunt with anyone because I believe that there are just too many eyes and ears there for two people to get close. Not saying it cannot happen, just saying that the odds are, exponentially,  better if you are alone.

Even though I've taken my fair share of record book bulls, there will be others that, most certainly, disagree with me. I'm sure things are different, better buglers, etc., but for me, these are my rules.

The best thing for you and your daughter is time in the woods, experience. You will, eventually, figure out what works (nothing works 100% of the time) and what does not work. One thing you could try is heading somewhere, after the early archery season, that has lot's of rutting bulls. All my hunting is on the O.P. so, naturally, the Olympic National Park is a great place to gain some experience, for me. Pick a river drainage, Quinault, Queets, Hoh, Bogachiel, pack a day pack and go hike 10 or 15 miles up a trail. You'll find elk. Try some things out. If nothing else, you'll have a great time!

It has taken me many years to figure this out. Any set up my not work 100% but that bwhnter350 says is spot on from what I have seen in my bowhunting time in the elk woods.

[LDennis24]

When your in that close to a bull and his cows believe it or not noise can be your friend... I was hunting once with my cousin by Mt.  Adams and we had a bull and his cows at about 70 yds through the trees but couldn't see them because of all  the vine maple in the area we were in. I quickly decided that right after a bugle I would start raking and beating a small tree next to his personally rubbed tree, with a large log/bat stick and a bull came running in so fast that he pinned me down in a small opening cuz he came in so quickly I couldn't hide anywhere! I just curled up in a ball behind the small tree! My cousin was about 10yds behind me and was so nervous he waited for what seemed like 5mins before flinging an arrow at him. This hunt was really intense but ended on a bad note as we never found the bill even after three days. The next year we found a full body skeleton nearby without a head and assume someone else found it after we went home empty handed. It was still the best year I ever hunted elk...